Re: word usage

[Snoopy the Celtics Beagle <snoopy@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

At 02:47 PM 4/12/03 -0700, Ryan W wrote:
>Let me spell out the usage.  Racism is wrong.  It is
>irrational to discriminate on the basis of skin color.
>  Likewise it is irrational to say that if one plays
>defense very well without providing offensive, then it
>warrants playing time (a la Grant Long), turning
>around later and not playing Kedrick Brown.
>
>Let's put it like this:
>
>Proposition One:  Players who play defense very well
>will get playing time (a paraphrase of what O'Brien
>said earlier this year--and the only reason Grant Long
>gets time).
>
>Proposition Two:  Kedrick Brown plays great defense
>(attested by Paul, Antione, coach O'Brien, me, you,
>Tommy, etc...)
>
>Conclusion:  Kedrick Brown should get playing time.
>
>But Kedrick Brown doesn't see the light of day...and
>when he does, and is praised, he later gets a
>reduction of playing time to about 1-2 meaningless
>minutes.  And so, like racist people (who, as I will
>later address, perhaps would describe an African
>American person as a "******"---which I won't write
>here, because, yes, it is offensive in this usage),
>O'Brien is being either irrational or stupid (or maybe
>his stupidity is a sign of his irrational nature).
>
>And so, back to the analogy which was stated as "What
>does a nigger have to do to get some PT up in this
>motherfucker?" originally, I was commenting on the
>analogous situations of irrational discrimination (one
>being the irrationality of racism, the other the
>irrationality of not playing Kedrick Brown given the
>criterion for getting playing time).  If you didn't
>get it, sorry.

You believe that Kedrick Brown was discriminated against by his coach; and 
deliberately use a word in the context of discrimination that is so 
lethally charged with emotion and history that if you DIDN'T know it would 
be offensive, you would almost have to be a moron.  That's simply not an 
acceptable defense--or usage, in that instance.

> > Not only that, but the fact that the Celtics as a
> > team have such a long and
> > well-documented history of fighting racism, that the
> > use of the word in
> > describing a Celtics player is mind-boggling.
>
>This is a total misrepresentation.  "Nigger" as a
>word, concept, or idea was used in part of a larger
>description concerning irrationality (as I've already
>pointed out).  It was *not* used to describe a
>Celtic's player.  Come on, Snoop...before seeing
>something and immediately correlating racist intent,
>please check out the usage.  Anything came be used for
>beneficial or improper means, including the word
>"nigger", and one must look past the mere
>instantiation of the word to discover and judge its
>application.

You said of Kedrick, "What does a *****have to do to get playing 
time?"  How is that not being used to describe him, when you previously 
stated--in your own words, above--that you WERE in fact, using that word to 
describe him in this situation.

I'm a professional writer, Ryan.  I've travelled extensively in my life, 
and met lots of people whose views on race (among myriad other subjects) 
are as diverse as snowflakes in a blizzard.  I've had extensive discussions 
with several of them over the years, and I've yet to see a modern usage of 
the word that was in any way inoffensive.

Speaking of "checking the usage" of words, please do not misquote me.  I 
went out of my way NOT to suggest that you had racist intent.  I 
specifically stated that WHATEVER your intent, what came across was 
something that could easily PERCEIVED as racist.  I don't know your intent, 
only it's effects.  Your efforts to defend your choice of words have been, 
to me anyway, unconvincing.

>Don't worry, I not taking anything you say as the
>intention to start a beef.  I'm just showing you where
>you're wrong :)

But the problem is, you HAVEN'T shown that.  You've made contradictory 
statements in an attempt to defend a choice of expression that was, at 
best, questionable in it's use.

And I can see where this is going.  People are going to start weighing in 
on this subject, instead of concentrating on the Celtics.  I think that 
ideally, we should just agree to disagree and move on.  Failing that, I 
think this subject might be better taken off the list, and those who might 
wish to continue discussion may do so without weighing down the list with a 
topic that isn't really suited to the list as a whole.

Snoopy the Celtics Beagle
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