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Re: word usage

Dude, its nuts to be defending using that word on a list-serv. Perhaps you might use it around your friends, family or at a bar. However, to use it on a list-serv, where you have no idea of the sensitivities of the audience, is out of bounds in todays world.
Certainly, Kedrick gets shafted in terms of PT - not even getting regular pt during blowouts, but does that make it worth upsetting/alienating a potential chunk of the readership?
On Sat, 12 Apr 2003 22:46:05 -0400
Snoopy the Celtics Beagle <snoopy@celticsbeagle.net> wrote:
At 02:47 PM 4/12/03 -0700, Ryan W wrote:

Let me spell out the usage.  Racism is wrong.  It is
irrational to discriminate on the basis of skin color.
 Likewise it is irrational to say that if one plays
defense very well without providing offensive, then it
warrants playing time (a la Grant Long), turning
around later and not playing Kedrick Brown.

Let's put it like this:

Proposition One:  Players who play defense very well
will get playing time (a paraphrase of what O'Brien
said earlier this year--and the only reason Grant Long
gets time).

Proposition Two:  Kedrick Brown plays great defense
(attested by Paul, Antione, coach O'Brien, me, you,
Tommy, etc...)

Conclusion:  Kedrick Brown should get playing time.

But Kedrick Brown doesn't see the light of day...and
when he does, and is praised, he later gets a
reduction of playing time to about 1-2 meaningless
minutes.  And so, like racist people (who, as I will
later address, perhaps would describe an African
American person as a "******"---which I won't write
here, because, yes, it is offensive in this usage),
O'Brien is being either irrational or stupid (or maybe
his stupidity is a sign of his irrational nature).

And so, back to the analogy which was stated as "What
does a nigger have to do to get some PT up in this
motherfucker?" originally, I was commenting on the
analogous situations of irrational discrimination (one
being the irrationality of racism, the other the
irrationality of not playing Kedrick Brown given the
criterion for getting playing time).  If you didn't
get it, sorry.
You believe that Kedrick Brown was discriminated against by his coach; and deliberately use a word in the context of discrimination that is so lethally charged with emotion and history that if you DIDN'T know it would be offensive, you would almost have to be a moron. That's simply not an acceptable defense--or usage, in that instance.

> Not only that, but the fact that the Celtics as a
> team have such a long and
> well-documented history of fighting racism, that the
> use of the word in
> describing a Celtics player is mind-boggling.

This is a total misrepresentation.  "Nigger" as a
word, concept, or idea was used in part of a larger
description concerning irrationality (as I've already
pointed out).  It was *not* used to describe a
Celtic's player.  Come on, Snoop...before seeing
something and immediately correlating racist intent,
please check out the usage.  Anything came be used for
beneficial or improper means, including the word
"nigger", and one must look past the mere
instantiation of the word to discover and judge its
application.
You said of Kedrick, "What does a *****have to do to get playing time?" How is that not being used to describe him, when you previously stated--in your own words, above--that you WERE in fact, using that word to describe him in this situation.

I'm a professional writer, Ryan. I've travelled extensively in my life, and met lots of people whose views on race (among myriad other subjects) are as diverse as snowflakes in a blizzard. I've had extensive discussions with several of them over the years, and I've yet to see a modern usage of the word that was in any way inoffensive.

Speaking of "checking the usage" of words, please do not misquote me. I went out of my way NOT to suggest that you had racist intent. I specifically stated that WHATEVER your intent, what came across was something that could easily PERCEIVED as racist. I don't know your intent, only it's effects. Your efforts to defend your choice of words have been, to me anyway, unconvincing.

Don't worry, I not taking anything you say as the
intention to start a beef.  I'm just showing you where
you're wrong :)
But the problem is, you HAVEN'T shown that. You've made contradictory statements in an attempt to defend a choice of expression that was, at best, questionable in it's use.

And I can see where this is going. People are going to start weighing in on this subject, instead of concentrating on the Celtics. I think that ideally, we should just agree to disagree and move on. Failing that, I think this subject might be better taken off the list, and those who might wish to continue discussion may do so without weighing down the list with a topic that isn't really suited to the list as a whole.

Snoopy the Celtics Beagle
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