Who/Punk

[Lucas Bleicher <bleicher@who.net>]

Mark Leaman wrote:

> I was thinking of the first two albums, but the change really came when it
> became a four man band.

Their first album surely influenced lots of prog bands in the seventies,
but
to me, Crimson was truly revolutionary on their Bruford-Wetton and 80's
phases.
By the way, it's a band that I really like, because it's one of the rare
bands
that didn't felt straight into pop in the end of the 70's/beginning of
the 80's.
While ELP released "Love Beach", Yes released 90125, Genesis released
all that
crap with Phil Collins and even the Who became a bit "poppy", King
Crimson 
never gave up creating complex and imaginative music. Their last album
has one
of the most creative things I heard in the 90's: "ProzaKc Blues".
I like Who's "You Better You Bet" and Yes' "Love Will Find a Way" very
much,
but to me it's saddening to see that these bands preferred this easy
path.
I admire Fripp et al because they never fell into that.
Someone commented, some months (or years, I really don't remember) on
this list
(or maybe on the other, that I don't read anymore) that it would be much
more
interesting if the who used the totally opposite style of Kenney Jones
to release
something more tended to fusion. To me, it would be really much better.
The
result would be really, really great, I always think about that when I
hear Pete's
jazzy solo on "Music Must Change".
 
> Don't look at it that way. Consider, rather, that The Who NOT ONLY invented
> Punk but Heavy Metal and Progressive Rock too! This apart from their effect
> on Rock in general...but more specifically.

I have no doubt that The Who was the main influence on heavy metal
(although
the first song that sounds like what's called HM nowadays, to me, is the
beatles'
Helter Skelter), and The Who did a very important role on the creation
of
progressive rock (I always denied the notion of saying that just one
band or
individual invented progressive rock, because it's a very plural styles,
which
roots can be found not just on the who, but also moody blues, some
Beatles, the
nice, and the Canterbury scene), but I insist that calling the who the
inventors
of punk is nonsense. We recognize a punk song for its 2 or 3 power
chords harmony,
its drum lines that had almost no fills, the easy-assimilation
(sometimes even comic)
lyrics, and the bass lines which consisted on repeating the same note
for each chord.
On the other side, The Who has pretty complex harmonies (when talking
about rock'n'roll),
the drummer kept doing creative fills and drum lines sometimes during
the whole song,
the lyrics were imaginative and thoughtful, and the bassist kept soloing
all the time.
To me, these facts are sufficient to say that this "Who was the first
punk band" notion
is completely false.
 
> I can imagine it. Imagine...stay with me now, imagine 21st Century Schiziod
> Man with Keith...ahhhh....yes...now try Elephant Talk...uh huh...that's got
> it...

Maybe he would sound very good on, say, "Red". But what about on "Frame
By Frame"? "Fracture"?
I think that Moon playing any of the 80's Crimson songs would be
disastrous...
 
> Well, I have yet to hear the Rush song that doesn't sound a bit flat and
> contrived, whereas even in their most synthesized moments (Quad? 905?) The
> Who have that natural get-up-outta-yer-seat thing. "I'd rather lose me to
> find you..."

Well, I like it.
 
> I try as much as I can to disengage myself from preference here. Instead, I
> look to what happened when and where, and what can be seen as a result.
> Basically a "family tree" of albums which show the trends of Rock music over
> the years. Pearl Jam, I think, made the most essential album of the 90's.
> They might be on the end of a branch, but still one should own Ten. Every
> song on it speaks to you, maybe depending on your life experience, but to me
> a song like Black is every bit as moving as Sunrise or Tangerine (Zeppelin).
> Man, WHAT a song! Alive...well, I could go on and on about Ten...I just
> think it's essential.

But when we talk about musical impact, I don't think that any PJ album
was more
important than what Rush did. Not even comes close.
 
> Both have that synthesized sterility. You can hear a bit on that in
> Industrial, and newer stuff like Orgy and White Zombie too.

"Synthesized sterility" is a bit vague, isn't it? So, does it mean that
Rush, ELP and dance music are all alike?
 
>>Derek and The Dominos???
 
> It's that percision thing. Like I said, listen to thier version of Little
> Wing. Even the song Layla has it, really. Key To The Highway, Tell The
> Truth...yeah, it's there.

I'll look for that specific song. But I have listened to Layla, Key to
the
Highway and Tell The Truth and I just can't find any relation to Rush on
them.
 
>>Peart or Bruford, for that matter). I've played with a
>>guy that could cover the three styles perfectly well.
 
> Then he should be a star, because I've never heard a professional drummer in
> ANY recorded band who could!

No, he shouldn't. Finding good musicians is much easier than most can
think.
Some people listen to some specific bassists/guitarists/drummers as if
what
the guy does is impossible to any man on earth to repeat. Well, if a guy
can do it, than it's not a problem if another could do it too. Many
studio
players are forced to learn different styles, and some of them masters a
number of styles too. Most of them never gets famous for that. I'd say
that
the best guitarist/drummers/bassists on the world may not be playing on
stadiums, but rather working as studio musicians, or as music university
professors. I know two guys here in a Fortaleza, which is just a
two-million
dwellers city in Brazil, that masters the three styles above. I even
played
with one of them, which is now playing with a reggae band in Sao Paulo.
The
other is leaving Brazil next year, to complete his studies in a music
university on Berlim, where a bassist from Fortaleza who can play any
Entwistle
lick now is a teacher.
Moon, Peart and Bruford where important because they did an enormous
influence
on other drummers. But nowadays, it's not difficult to find very good
drummers
that can do what they did...

Lucas