Re: Pete's Women

["Mark R. Leaman" <mleaman@sccoast.net>]

> Ah yes, but there really is no such thing as objective writing!

Yellow:

I'll grant you that. And will accept your definition of Female #1 as a
young, somewhat innocent groupie type.

> I believe Virginia would also fit nicely into the Female #1 group

Again, granted.

> The unnamed heroine of "A Quick One, While He's Away" is also fairly similar.

Here I would have to point out that she's not "starstruck" (as Ray
Davies might call it), but instead just innocent. Call her Female #1a,
perhaps.

> Well, first of all, I suspect that the film version of Mrs. Walker
> was strongly influenced by Ken Russel's vision

I think that's true. Not having the soundtrack handy, I couldn't tell if
Pete had written (or co-written) the screenplay, and forgot to check
last night.

> However, interviews and
> stage comments from Pete from around the time of the album do give
> several clues as to what he was thinking about for her character
> (Female #2, the mother group).

I'll accept your definition of Female #2.

> after this fancy man is murdered she and Captain
> Walker give little Tommy a good smack and start saying "You didn't
> hear it..." because "That's the kind of people they are".

Perhaps, but again I would say that in a moment so emotional she might
be forgiven the deed. That's the kind of people most people are, and you
must keep in mind parenting has changed a lot since the 50s (or 20s, by
the album version). Kids were more likely to get "a good smack," nor was
it any big deal. By the same token, the actions of Cousin Kevin & Uncle
Ernie were shocking by the standards of 1969, whereas today both might
have a web page or two.
It is always important to take any work of fiction, especially if it's
set in the past, with the attitudes and behavior patterns of the time.
And of the author's experiences.

> But I think she's pretty obviously based off of Pete's image
> of his own mother

I've read she was based on his grandmother, although I will admit it was
in the extremely inaccurate Behind Blue Eyes (Hi, Alan!). Still, it
appeared to be an interview with Pete.

> I don't want to spoil the play for you

Don't worry; I'll never see it. I have no interest in Broadway plays. In
fact, I cringe to think of Rock music made "nice" for the broader
audience, even as I did when Daltrey toured with an orchestra.

> The paralells between THESE two are quite clear.

This too I will grant, although I would call this Female #3. A
predatory, manipulative type.

> somehow also quite sexy.  (Doesn't Pete ever think about anything else?

Sex is not only the driving force in Rock music (after all, what do you
think the term "rock and roll" really means? Not dancing!), it's a
primary driving force for the human race. One reason RnR was called
"Devil's music" (and still is by some) is the sexual nature of the music
and lyrics. If you take it away, what are you left with? Michael Bolton?
Peter Frampton? Yow!
Dangerous people are considered sexy by many...powerful people too, and
I would say both fit into that catagory as well. So I don't begrudge
Pete this. Nor do I think sex is in the "gutter"...unless they're doing
it differently up where you live! There are laws against that sort of
thing here...

> Mrs. Walker, like Ruth and
> the Dragon, is partially to blame for the troubles of the hero.  She
> shares this blame with Captain Walker, just as Ruth does with Rastus.

Again, I would disagree. Ruth and the Dragon were conscious of what they
were doing, and did it with intent, while I would call Nora the victim
of circumstances. She got a "fancy man" because she thought her husband
was dead...this is normal behavior! How many of us have broken up with
someone, or lost someone, only to jump right back into a relationship
just so we'd feel better? It's something that helps the healing process,
even if it is rather superficial and not particularly mature.
Ruth and Ms. D were taking advantage...Nora was not. That draws a clear
distinction, at least for me.

> ahh, oui . . . she was inspired by a groupie

raine:

Thanks for the details. That's what makes it all so interesting, I
think.

> What about the woman in A Legal Matter?
> That is a situation that holds true today....

B:

I think I'd better leave it to Yellow to place her into a catagory.
Actually, the only thing we know about this girl is that she wants to
get married, and is thinking about having a kid. Placing it in context
with the time, this was a fairly common feeling after finishing
school...it was the next step for women, who weren't so much a part of
the workforce then. And it could be linked to Nora, who perhaps (like a
lot of women) felt incomplete without a man.
Pete's attitude was also fairly common, during the time.

- -- 

            Cheers                ML

 "It's more than a looking back...it's a bringing up to date.
  Quadrophenia is about where we're all at today...maybe you too,
  I don't know..."
            Pete Townshend