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Re: Carroll is an Idiot...and owes me $60



I was just speculating, but think that this trade would be similar to the walker deal -- Allen isn't as good as Pierce, but may ultimately fit our system better.

like i said i'm not sold on getting rid of Pierce...yet. I still think he can be an all-time great, but he has to want it and show it. the talent is now there for him to do it, I'm willing to give him next year with a REAL coach.

It might be hard to get D. Mason included in the deal -- since he now plays for the Milwaukee Bucks, but we could try :)

(the other) mark


On Mar 22, 2004, at 11:21 AM, Josh Ozersky wrote:


Ray Allen isn't a real star; he's just a quality NBA starter
at this point.  His upside is used up; he's another guy who
doesn't want to be the Man.  If we trade Paul, I want Desmond
Mason too.

Josh

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Piotrowski" <markp@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: "Celtics" <celtics@xxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 11:10 AM
Subject: Carroll is an Idiot...and owes me $60


1. On Carroll Being an Idiot and owing me money

On Mar 21, 2004, at 10:33 AM, Celtic4Hire@xxxxxxx wrote:

Walter was so tired with about six minutes left last night that he was
waiting at the top of the three point line with his hands on his
knees. Not good
that you are going into crunch time with what you (Carroll in this
case) think is
your best power forward and he is totally fatigued. You can get away
with
that on a highly skill set player but on a limited player like Walter,
it can
kill you. Coaching error.

As i've said before (coined the phrase?) Carroll is an idiot. It's not
a coaching error Celtic4Hire, he's just an idiot who doesn't know how
to coach.


And he owes me $60.

After the stretch of games where Hunter actually was let off the bench
I was so excited about this team -- i didn't care about wins or losses
just that Hunter, Banks, Davis and Welsch were being given the chance
to play -- I went out and got cable to see the 4 ESPN games this month
(usually i'm relegated to going to the bar and seeing the C's play.)

After the Mavs game I vowed I would not watch another Celtics game
until John Carroll is gone. I seriously can't handle it -- i'm afraid
i'm going to have an annuerysm or heart attack. Its so much different
than even the ML Carr days -- which i got to see in person. At least
then you knew the problem was the talent level -- all you could do was
wait till next season. The problem now is not the talent level -- but
Carroll's butchering of that talent. I hate him. And would like it if
he'd reimburse me the money i wasted on cable (the silver lining is
getting to watch actual NBA teams with coaches who have a clue).


I TOTALLY disagree with the suggestion that Hunter has played his way
back onto the bench. No way. You simply cannot tell me that someone
can go out and average 10 points and 10 rebounds a game deserves to be
playing 0 minutes when our biggest problem is rebounding. And throw
that "it was against weak teams" argument out the window. 9 rebounds
against the (Playoff-bound) Bucks and Brian Skinner (7.4 reb/gm), 16
against the Raptors who have good rebounders in Chris Bosh (7.5 reb/gm)
and Donyell Marshall (10.5 reb/gm). And what about 8 rebounds in 9
minutes vs. Portland () or 9 in 19 mins vs. that horrible team the
Nets. Even in the T-Wolves game -- the game that started Hunters fall
from grace b/c supposedly he didn't match up with Minn. big front line
-- he got 6 boards in 13 minutes.


C'mon.  Hunter *might* be undersized but you don't play the games on
the height/weight chart.  It's what you do on the court that matters.
Carroll, being the idiot he is, is creating a self-fulfilling prophecy
by not playing Hunter more than 3 minutes.  I almost kicked the TV in
when Walter came in with 6 mins. left in the 1st Quarter against
Dallas.

The thing i fear the most -- and what i'll never forgive Carroll for --
is that Hunter loses his confidence with this starting, playing 5
minutes then sittting bullsh*t. Or that he ends up starring for
another team b/c our coach was too stupid to play him.



1a. On Blount


As much as I love what Blount's doing on the court I'm getting sick of
his wanting to leave. Too bad the Cleveland deal couldn't have been
Davis +Mihm for Blount + Battie -- letting us keep EWill. I agree with
others that to overpay Blount would be a horrible choice -- esp.
considering we have some talent to fill the hole left by his departure.


But can anyone clarify if we have the ability to sign-and-trade him for
more than he might make by straight-up signing as a FA with another
team? If we can sign + trade him and if he really wants to go to
Portland if O'Brien lands there, i'd really, really push for a deal of:


Pierce + (resigned) Blount + 1 or 2 #1's --> Z. Randolph + Derek
Andrson + Ruben Patterson (then waive Patterson -- i don't want him on
this team at all).


PG:  Atkins / Banks
SG: Anderson / Welsch
SF: Davis / (Welsch) / Jones
PF: Randolph / Hunter
C: LaFrentz / Mihm / Perkins

1-2 #1s + MLE

I said a month or 2 ago -- one of the few types of players i'd trade
Pierce for is a young PF or C. Randolph is that type of player -- and
might be a tad more available now since the arrival of Abdur-Rahim and
Ratliff. I may have to concede to Mark B. and others that Pierce is
not the player he was and that he *may* not get back there. I'm so
torn on him right now. But also think that his stock is still about as
high --- and that he might fetch as much now as ever, esp. when bundled
with some of our assets. And the presence of Welsch and Davis makes at
least looking around possible.



2. On Pierce & McGrady


I was never one to want to trade Pierce -- and still hope/think that
with a proper coach he CAN return to form -- but (along the lines of
Chad Ford's column that Mark B posted) I would very seriously
consider/persue a deal for McGrady, something like:

Pierce, (resigned) Blount, Michael Stewart (to give them cap room next
summer), and our 3 #1 picks for

McGrady, Gooden and their 2nd round pick

If our offering isn't enough to get it done, i throw in our #1 in 2
years too (you can't trade #1 picks in successive years). Or throw in
Davis or Welsch (since McGrady would leave them few minutes).

We'd have a beautiful, running lineup of:

PG:  Atkins / Banks
SG: McGrady / Welsch
SF: Davis / (Welsch) / Jones
PF: Gooden / Hunter
C: LaFrentz / Mihm / Perkins

A team too that would match up well against Detroit and Indiana -- the
new power brokers in the East.  Orlando has to get some more talent
(our picks) and we'd still be able to add a good player/decent project
with Orlando's 2nd rounder (Kirk Snyder?), our 2nd rounder and our #1
next year.

Orlando gets an NBA all-star signed long term, a starting Center, 3 #1
picks to go with their #1



3. On Barry & Pierce

Failing getting McGrady -- i'd have to seriously push for widening the
Barry pursuit to include a Ray Allen - Paul Pierce swap.  Something
like

Barry + Ray allen for Pierce + (resigned) Blount + Stewart + Jumaine
Jones + a #1 pick.