Re: Just move on to next game

[Cecil <cecil@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

----- Original Message -----
From: Dan Forant <dforant1@nycap.rr.com>
To: <celtics@igtc.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 16, 2002 4:07 PM
Subject: Re: Just move on to next game


> Several thoughts. I don't see anything in Baker that would entice me to
have
> him on my team. I think he is a disaster. He's a dinosaur in modern times.
> Does he hurt the team? No, because we need all the help we can get even if
> it's none because he takes up space, expensively at that.
>
I guess you did not see the slam he made off the nice feed from Pierce as he
was rolling to the hoop.  And you missed his 3 blocks as well.  Or are you
just choosing to pretend they never really took place at all?  I think it is
obvious to any basketball observer that Vin has skills which will enhance
this team once he is accustomed to the style of play we use.  It just is not
as simple as perhaps it should be, for a big man to come to a team and play
the position as Harter would like.  It requires a lot of jumping out on
ballhandlers at the top of the key, recovering and trying to contain the
opposing big man after he has a step on you and is rolling to the basket.
It would be tough for anyone who hasn't played that way before, to just come
in and grasp it from the getgo.  You are so fickle.   Didn't you say in a
previous post that perhaps you were wrong about Baker?

> Pierce may not have his head in the game because of  the evolution of Delk
> and Shammond. The shots are getting spread out a little more now. He is
off
> stride with this.
>
He has missed shots lately.  I don't believe it has one thing to do with
anyone else or the amount of shots they are getting.  He is still getting
plenty of looks.  He'll start knocking them down and when he does, true to
form, you will sing his praises.

> Toine has to lay of the whining with the refs. So he's captain, refs don't
> want to here him all nite. Just wasted energy and is not helping us get to
> the line anymore.
>
I am starting to believe that he has every right to say something.  He's
getting screwed and we all know it.  I wonder if anyone in the league office
cares about the disparity in player treatment by these referees.  Jordan
complains about everything, yet gets nary a second look.  Toine smiles, he
gets a T.  Baker, supposedly an unemotional zombie, yells at a guy, like
that doesn't happen on a nightly basis in the league, and he gets a T.  I've
seen two players push each other and nobody gets called for anything.  When
one of our guys gets a T for yelling, not at an official, but at an
opponent, we are not being treated properly when this other stuff is allowed
to fester.  I mentioned in the past that Pierce gets hacked on almost every
drive to the basket.  I kinda understand why he has been remaining on the
perimeter.  It's his best chance to survive through the season if they are
not going to whistle the defenders for hitting him.  And in games where they
do call the fouls, they still don't call all of them.

Cecil




> DanF
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Cecil" <cecil@hfx.eastlink.ca>
> Cc: <celtics@igtc.com>
> Sent: Saturday, November 16, 2002 10:29 AM
> Subject: Re: Just move on to next game
>
>
> > I am interested to find out just how the Cavs defensed Dirk on Wednesday
> > night in holding him to 4 points going into the 4th quarter.  He ended
up
> > with 17 points by virtue of shooting 12-12 from the line.  Bradley
fouled
> > out with 6 points.  Course the Cavs had Ilgauskas with a career
offensive
> > night to put the pressure on them.
> >
> > One thing I like about Vin is his willingness to take it to them
> regardless.
> > That mentality is not one of a depressed moronic scaredy-cat who is on
the
> > brink of the looney bin.  This will pay off later this season when the
> refs
> > pull their heads outta their butts.  I think he is progressing as
> expected,
> > with learning new systems and all.  It really does take time to
understand
> > schemes and be able to react accordingly but it is coming.  The 3 blocks

> and
> > the feistiness is a very positive sign.  I still am scratching my head
> over
> > the technicals.
> >
> > Paul has had 2 stinkeroos in a row.  Poor games for him but hopefully
this
> > will show him that he is not invincible and still has aspects of his
game
> to
> > improve.  He did make a gorgeous pass to Delk for what should have been
an
> > easy layup which tony was unable to convert.  It's a noticeable addition
> to
> > Paul's game for those of us willing to take the time to observe.  Though
> he
> > did take a few shots which had me cringing, he also moved the ball very
> well
> > at times.  The way to beat the Mavs is ball movement I think because I
do
> > not feel that Dirk and Shawn are outstanding defenders, though they are
> > long.  I'd still like to see Battie at the line in the high post with
> > cutters.  When we have penetration stuffed, he can hit that shot 80% of
> the
> > time if we have proper positioning and spacing.
> >
> > Toine seemed to make more of an effort to take the ball inside against
> > Dallas more than in any other game in recent memory.  And his success
rate
> > was excellent.  That is why I say put the Battie in the high post and
let
> > Walker work against the opposing PF low.  Toine is a good enough passer
to
> > be able to make the right pass if doubled.
> >
> > I am encouraged by the combined effort of Shammond and Delk.  38 points
> > between them last night against a good team bodes well down the road
too.
> > My question though is why did we not try to pressure Nash more in the
last
> 2
> > minutes?  Seemed that we let him bring the ball up and try to pressure
the
> > receiver.  Nash is a clever ballhandler (of course, he's Canadian :-))
but
> > shouldn't we go after whomever it is with the ball at that stage?
> >
> > Finally, anytime we go an entire game with Walker of Pierce shooting a
> > single free throw, we are in for a long night.  Tommy is a homer
> > undoubtedly, but he was right about a few of last night's non-calls by
the
> > zebras, especially once on Delk when he clearly got hit en route to the
> > hoop.  We should be at the line a minimum of 20 attempts per game.  Last
> > night, it was 12 times, with 6 of those from EWill.
> >
> > For those of you who attend the games, I will be in attendance for the
New
> > Year's Eve afternoon game vs the Griz.  Would love to meet up with
anyone
> > else who is going.  It's a 2pm start.
> >
> > Cecil
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <Celtic4Hire@AOL.com>
> > To: <Celticsstuffgroup@yahoogroups.com>
> > Cc: <celtics@igtc.com>
> > Sent: Saturday, November 16, 2002 10:18 AM
> > Subject: Just move on to next game
> >
> >
> > > Well, we got whooped. The Mavs played an extended zone with two 7
> footers,
> > > Bradley and Noviski, in the low blocks. The Celts strategy to beat a
> zone
> > has
> > > been either to shoot threes or penetrate through the low blocks.
> However,
> > > they weren't hitting their threes and the drivers, Pierce and
Williams,
> > kept
> > > getting swallowed up by Bradley. On the defensive end, the Mavs kept
> > hitting
> > > killer shot after killer shot with even their week offensive links,
> > Bradley
> > > and Nahera able to hit on more than a few open jumpers. This really
> > reminded
> > > of the Net playoff series with just a few alterations.
> > >
> > > What else could we have done? Although Bradley blocked his openning
> > attempt,
> > > I would have liked to see them go to Vin in the low block and see if
we
> > could
> > > pick up some fouls on Bradley and get him out of there. That could
open
> up
> > > things for Walker and Pierce. It may not have made a difference the
way
> > the
> > > Mavs were shooting but I would have hoped they would have tried that
> > during a
> > > playoff series. During the regular season, you can just move on to the
> > next
> > > game. If our threes aren't falling against other teams playing zones,
I
> > would
> > > like to see Shammond penetrate and be able to pull up and hit the
jumper
> > at
> > > the elbow instead of passing it back out. That is another way of
beating
> > an
> > > extended zone, penetrate by the ended zone at the top and pull up at
the
> > free
> > > throw line elbow for a shot before the low blocks reach you....
> > >
> > > Also, for the loser who said Vin had another bad game, Vin had about 5
> > > blocks. What do you want? Vin is really picking it up on the defensive
> > end.
> > > Early in the games, he seems to have a hard time getting past the
> bobbles.
> > > But if you want points, you got to put him in a good position to
score.
> I
> > > don't know why they didn't post him up in the left block, his best
> > offensive
> > > spot on the floor. Instead, they tried a couple of times on the right
> > block
> > > and then forgot about him....
> > >
> > > I don't know what it is with these refs but some of these guys like
Mr.
> > FBI
> > > seem to pick on people that don't like. Vin, after getting shoved hard
> in
> > the
> > > back while in the air, gets a T for approaching Finley and asking,
"Hey,
> > > what's up with that Mike?" Walker gets a T for just staring at the ref
> > after
> > > previously getting a delay of game where he said he didn't even touch
> the
> > > ball. Maybe Walker was trying to get under his skin by doing some
little
> > > things. But after watching what his Airness can get away with the
refs,
> > you
> > > would think that they could use a more common standard....
> > >
> > > DJessen33
> > >
> > > DJessen33