Re: McHale Puts Pierce And Walker In Their Places

["Jaims" <jaims@info.com.ph>]

For me, simply said, you must really win a championship before being called
great or a legend.  otherwise, you are just a good and talented player...

Jaims
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cecil Wright" <cecil@hfx.eastlink.ca>
To: "Celtics Emai List" <Celtics@igtc.com>
Sent: Sunday, February 03, 2002 7:36 AM
Subject: Re: McHale Puts Pierce And Walker In Their Places


> Dan's comments below have me wondering how we come to judge player
ability.
> For example, he says that Paul is better than Toine but really gives no
real
> criteria for his determination.
>
> I ask the rest of you:
>
> What do you use to judge player ability, and, as McHale says, is it only
by
> virtue of winning championships that a player becomes great?
>
> Cecil
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Dan F" <dforant1@nycap.rr.com>
> To: "Celtics Emai List" <Celtics@igtc.com>
> Sent: Saturday, February 02, 2002 10:37 AM
> Subject: Re: McHale Puts Pierce And Walker In Their Places
>
>
> > Well, I agree with McHale entirely. He was always spoke his mind. Pierce
> is
> > no Bird (or many of the others yet). Paul is developing fast no doubt.
He
> at
> > this point lacks floor vision, and  defensive skills, mentally not
> > physically,, Triple doubles may be in his future, he will need them to
be
> > mentioned in the same level as Bird. As far as Walker is concerned he's
a
> > *good* player by today's standards but below Pierce's level whose a many
> > accomplishments below Birds. Bird may have gone 10-24 a lot but the last
4
> > baskets usually had something to do with the outcome of the game (wins).
> >
> > DanF
> >
> > "Way Of The Ray" <wayray@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
> > 3C5C2914.BB3531A6@ix.netcom.com">news:3C5C2914.BB3531A6@ix.netcom.com...
> > > Interesting comments by Kevin, another guy who wanted to remain with
the
> > >
> > > Celtics in a magnagement capacity, and was scorned by Gaston.....
> > >
> > > McHale quite forward on Celtics greatness
> > >
> > > by Karen Guregian
> > > Bosston Herald Sports
> > > Saturday, February 2, 2002
> > >
> > >
> > > The question seemed innocent enough. Kevin McHale was asked where he'd
> > > rank Antoine Walker and Paul Pierce in the pantheon of Celtic greats.
> > >
> > > Let's just say the most outspoken member of Boston's famed ``Big
> > > Three,'' who was in town last night with his Minnesota Timberwolves,
> > > still loves to stir a pot.
> > >
> > > ``(Expletive), c'mon. They couldn't carry Larry Bird's jock around,''
an
> > > incredulous McHale said of Walker and Pierce while sitting in the
> > > visiting coach's room prior to last night's 98-95 overtime victory
over
> > > the Celtics.
> > >
> > > Well, that saucy retort is probably not as inflammatory as it sounds,
> > > because few, if any players, could hold - a candle - to Bird. The
> > > Wolves' vice president of basketball operations then put his remark
into
> > > a little better context, although not by much. McHale classified
Walker
> > > and Pierce as ``good'' players, but wouldn't put them in the same
> > > stratosphere as Bird or other Celtic legends.
> > >
> > > Why? Because Walker and Pierce still haven't put up a banner in the
> > > rafters.
> > >
> > > ``I hope the standard hasn't (changed so much),'' McHale said. ``If
you
> > > win championships, then you become great. You don't become great if
you
> > > don't win championships. You are considered a great player when you
win.
> > > Bill Russell, (Bob) Cousy, (John) Havlicek, (Dave) Cowens, Jo Jo
> > > (White), the Jones boys (Sam and K.C). That's elite company. You win
> > > some championships, then you mention their names. Prior to that, it's
a
> > > tad premature.''
> > >
> > > Championship-less wonders such as Ernie Banks, Ted Williams, Carl
> > > Yastrzemski, Dan Marino, Charles Barkley and Karl Malone would have
just
> > > cause to disagree about the definition of greatness. Not surprisingly,
> > > Pierce didn't want to engage in any part of McHale comments following
> > > the team's fourth loss in five games.
> > >
> > > ``No comment,'' Pierce said when apprised of the jockstrap remark. ``I
> > > don't want to be compared to them. I'm here to make my own name. They
> > > did what they had to do in their time. I'm here to do what I got to do
> > > in my time.''
> > >
> > > Walker, on the other hand, waxed poetic on the subject after the game.
> > > He didn't seem at all fazed by the comments. In fact, he agreed with
> > > McHale's premise and chuckled over the Bird comparison.
> > >
> > > ``I think it's right. I think that's good,'' Walker said of McHale's
> > > remarks. ``I think that's more motivation for us to continue to get
> > > better as players. That lets us know we're a long way from being where
> > > we need to be as players and as a team.''
> > >
> > > Leave it to McHale to spice up an otherwise dull affair. It's obvious,
> > > though, in between putting Walker and Pierce in their rightful place
in
> > > history, he still bleeds green, even if it is bad form to diss fellow
> > > Celtic family members. McHale is genuinely pleased by the club's
> > > turnaround this season. And he didn't totally dismiss Walker and
Pierce,
> > > the first Celtic duo to make the All-Star team since 1991.
> > >
> > > ``I usually watch the first half of all of their games, so I've seen
> > > them a lot,'' said McHale, who watches on his satellite dish. ``It
seems
> > > like (Jim) O'Brien has been a breath of fresh air for everyone around
> > > here and the players are responding to it.
> > >
> > > ``They got Pierce and Walker playing very well for them. The rest of
the
> > > guys are filling in . . . so I'm happy for them. I'll always watch for
> > > them, and pull for them.''
> > >
> > > McHale wasn't surprised the Celts had come of age with little turnover
> > > from last year. In the Auerbach tradition, he too is a believer in
> > > keeping his teams together.
> > >
> > > ``We've had the same team together for essentially four or five
years,''
> > > McHale said. ``Believe me, the guy that used to run this place, Red
> > > Auerbach, he won 16 banners, believes in keeping guys together. When
you
> > > get guys you like, keep them together. That's not in, in today's
> > > (world). You have to turn your roster over every other year. That's a
> > > bunch of B.S. You win when you get key people together and develop
some
> > > chemistry. That's what I believe in. That comes from my days here.''
> > >
> > > And many of those days were spent winning championships. Maybe that's
> > > why he expects so much more of Walker and Pierce.