Re: Celtics Past: 1994

[j.hironaka@unesco.org]

Dan the man, thanks for the civil and intelligent reply. I knew this list would get
back on track again. I'll try to keep my reply shorter, to make up for my
embarrasingly long post earlier today.

Here's what I'll say in addition to what's already been said: sports writers I think
instinctively "protected" certain stars like Larry Bird by putting favorable quotes
in the best light or not necessarily publishing "off the record" comments  that may
have come across greedy or petty or mean-spirited. I can think of examples here and
there of these traits scattered out during Bird's career.

Here's a concrete example. On the day before the 1979 Indiana State-Michigan State
championship game, Larry Bird reportedly told reporters that "winning or losing the
championship game would make no difference because he was going to sign a big
professional contract either way" (this according to a story by Joe Gergen in the
TSN archive section). The article concluded, however, by sympathetically noting that
"Bird's actions betrayed his true feelings. At the buzzer, he walked to the
Sycamores' bench, put a towel to his eyes and cried."

Now imagine if Antoine Walker said something like that before a game, then proceeded
to shoot 7-21 from the field in an 11-point blowout loss? Would the article have
been written differently? How would they have treated the crybaby scene afterwards?

Maybe you don't agree that writers may overlooked some of Bird's stupidest comments
(not to mention the fact that he wore the world's ugliest shirts). :-) But I think
it is very hard to disagree with the assertion that Boston writers have gone out of
their way to trip up AW, drive a fake wedge between him and his coach, and paint a
not so subtle picture in every reader's mind that Antoine Walker is our very own
Iverson or Sprewell, and deserves to be boo-ed.

I'm really not saying it's about race. But I am saying it's about racial (or
socio-economic) mannerisms that we can't seem to stomach. I'd believe we'd
appreciate the many, solid all-around games Walker has already played for us in
Boston a lot more if he'd only act a little bit more middle class and white. If we
don't mind a pumped fist or a waved towel after a made basket, then we should not
let Antoine's wiggle tempt us into making ignorant and false assumptions about his
character. And yet we do this. It's obvious that we do this.

Joe


p.s. I don't agree with your reference to Antoine being a poor open-court passer. I
really don't.

--------

Dan Parker wrote:

> On Fri, 3 Sep 1999 j.hironaka@unesco.org wrote:
>
> > That's something I thought only warped people like me were capable of. :-)
>
> At several points, with blurry eyes and the knowledge of hindsight and
> what the repercussions of the Celtics moves that summer would be, I
> thought to myself, "My God!  Who else would subject themselves to
> reading all of this?"
>
> Slight pause.
>
> "Maybe Joe."  I mean that as a compliment.  ;)
>
> Antoine Walker
> ==============
>
> Okay, I've got to respond here.  Joe, I've always appreciated your
> messages about Antoine, as they've constantly made me question my position
> towards him.  If it wasn't for you I'm sure I would have written him off
> as a corrupt, selfish player with no hope of redemption.
>
> Nevertheless, I have to disagree with a few things you brought up.
>
> > Of course, people are welcome to continue debating whether our expectations of
> > how acceptable black athletes are superficially supposed to behave in Boston
> > (ideally "modest" and "humble" like Ron Mercer) don't ultimately affect fan
> > impressions about their actual value to a team (Ron Mercer naturally "didn't
> > need to be in the spotlight" even while leading the team in shot attempts and
> > missed shots after the winning February without him).
>
> Well, okay, first I'll agree with this completely.  Perhaps the uproar
> over the trading of Mercer, and the general consensus that the Celtics got
> the worst end of this deal is largely because of the "modest" and "humble"
> demeanor of Mercer, along with his flashy talents.  I mean, from a talent
> perspective, what does Mercer offer that J.R. Rider doesn't?  And wouldn't
> a Rider-for-Fortson deal be praised, especally if the team getting Fortson
> was in dire need of rebounding?
>
> > no-one showed up for Mercer's last second entreaties). And if Antoine were
> > accused of participating in any kind of gang rape incident, he would not get
> > off as easily as Ron Mercer has in the eyes of his fans. You'd hear some "I
> > told you so's" and "I knew there was something (criminal) about him" and "They
> > need to set an example by following through and prosecuting him to the full
> > extent of the law".
>
> Hmm, gotta agree with this too.  There has been surprisingly little about
> the whole Mercer/rape incident (wasn't there another player too?), which
> is probably as it should be -- innocent until proven guilty, and all that.
> You're dead on though in saying the fans and sportswriters  would not have
> been so apathetic about it had it been Antoine.  Thank goodness he had
> nothing to do with it -- he would have been crucified.
>
> > what he actually says and the sound of his voice (soft, serious, answers
> > questions with specifics, rarely throws out sports clichés). Then maybe ask
> > yourself how patently "selfish" it is to cut your shot selection to 15.6 per
> > game after February, rebuild your freethrow technique from scratch even if it
> > leads to disastrous results at first (for Potapenko and half the roster as
> > well), make turnovers off the dribble a rare occurance, stop getting technical
> > fouls even if you feel the white refs continue to let you get clobbered, rush
> > back from injury just to play in a few more meaningless games, or lead your
> > team by far in rebounding every season.
>
> The signs are there that he's not Benoit Benjamin:
>
> * Improved free throw shooting
>
> * Better relations with referees
>
> * Coming back from ankle injury to play, despite games meaning nothing
>
> On the other hand, he's shot himself in the foot a number of times:
>
> * Despite his wide array of talents, he suffered through *way* too may
> 4-16 type nights.  Seems completely incapable of laying off the shooting
> and concentrating on his other talents.
>
> * The "veteran All-Star" reference.
>
> * Okay, my memory is fuzzy here, but I think it was a game against
> Washington (maybe Miami).  In a previous game against the team, the man
> Antoine was guarding repeatedly beating him up the floor for baskets and
> said so after the game.  In the next matchup, Antoine scored something
> like 40, the Celtics lost, yet he seemed to think that was supposed to
> silence his critics (he said something after the game about it, along the
> lines of, "Still think he's better?")
>
> * Terrible, terrible decisions on the fast break, turning three-on-ones
> into a mad drive to the hoop where if he was lucky he drew a foul.  Then
> he'd point to someone who was on the wing and smile ("I saw you, man!").
> Repeat ad nauseum.
>
> * The wiggle.  Most fans hate it.  (I remember an early game in 'Toine's
> rookie season, where he made a basket, was fouled and unleashed a wiggle
> right into the camera.  Mike Gorman quickly said, "You can lose that,
> son."  Summed it up perfectly, I thought.)  Now, I'm not saying he
> shouldn't do it -- if he insists that's just the way he plays, well, fine.
> But be prepared to accept the consequences.  I can't sit in my office at
> work and curse people out and expect them to like me because "that's just
> the way I am."
>
> I'm not even going to count the "out of shape" accusations, since that
> seemed to snowball after the Celtics started losing.  Nobody was
> complaining about it at the beginning of the lockout-shortened season, but
> now it's generally accepted he was (15, 20, 30, take your pick) pounds
> overweight.
>
> > streak (Fort and Battleship). My point is that Antoine is a freak. He can
> > actually eventually average 6 assists and 10+ rebounds over 82 games,
> > something only one NBA forward, guard or center per every decade or so (a
> > championship player, in other words) has the innate talent to do.
>
> At what point do you decide that's never going to happen?  How many
> coaches thought they could coax a better performance out of Benoit
> Benjamin?  In my mind, this is the year.  I wish him the very best.  But
> if it doesn't happen, I'm not going to be upset if the C's look for
> offers.
>
> > Basically, it's hard not to conclude that
> > Boston fans tend to feel uncomfortable around (or rooting for) "those kinds of
> > black people". We should get whatever we deserve.
>
> Close.  I'm uncomfortable rooting for "those kinds of people".  No color
> is necessary.  Try and picture Larry Bird getting the ball in the post,
> showing a head fake, getting the defender in the air, drawing the foul,
> making the shot, then turning to his posse in section 8 and grinding his
> hips towards them (the Bird Boogie?).  My entire body recoils in horror at
> the thought of it.
>
> Why does Celtics Nation despise Jon Barry?  Because the uppity little punk
> wouldn't sign with the Celtics after being drafted.
>
> No?
>
> Dan