Re: Holley on who may be going. . .

[Josh Ozersky <josh_ozersky@yahoo.com>]

Tom,

Interesting comments.  Has there actually been any
suggestion of a Pistons/Celtics swap?  I see Mercer to
LA for Wright as a better and more likely trade
myself.  But you make a good case for Bison, who I
still can't stand, and see as a locker room cancer. 
BTW, it's never been established that Pitino ranted at
Paul Pierce, and I don't believe he did -- although
what Pierce perceived as blame, etc. is another story.
 

I'd rather have Battie than Dele or Williams. 
Williams is a hound, but shot blocking is better than
hounding.


--- Thomas Murphy  wrote:
> Thanks for the comments Josh! Its good to be back in
> the thick of things.
> 
> Regardless of what you think of Holley (although I
> do think you are
> needlessly negative on that score) trade winds are
> swirling about the
> Celts, in large part due to statements made by
> Pitino in the past and in
> particular his playoff pledge. Now, I was up front
> and stated that if I
> were to trade an asset I'd look to trade Walker. We
> all know that isn't
> going to happen. I've grown accustomed to the fact
> over the years that the
> Celts rarely do what I would ideally like them to
> do. So the question in my
> mind becomes "what WILL the Celts do?"
> 
> I can appreciate your feeling regarding Battie and
> agree that his
> shot-blocking is a sorely needed commodity on this
> team. I look at Battie
> and see a potentially solid complementary player, a
> Theo Ratliff-type. I
> would have had Battie in the starting line-up long
> ago myself but under
> Pitino it hasn't happened. It doesn't seem the
> Pitino is as thrilled with
> his game as we are - for whatever reason - and given
> that both his contract
> and Mercer's are up for extension at the same time
> it is unfortunate but
> they seem to be pitted against one another in
> Pitino's mind (or Gaston's
> checkbook). In such a contest my money's on Pitino
> retaining the UK alum
> (oops, almost wrote "grad") every time.
> 
> Would Jerome Williams be an improvement over Battie?
> JW is not as tall,
> doesn't block shots but he is constantly active,
> hard-nosed and seems to
> have his ego relatively in check - an Andrew
> DeClercq with more skills. And
> speaking of checks, JW could probably be retained
> for quite a bit less than
> Battie. Would Detroit part with him? I'm sure that
> they would rather not,
> but like the Celtics, they have to part with
> something if they want to
> build around their current core (Hill, Stackhouse,
> Laettner) and have a
> shot at persuading Hill to re-up in a few years. JW
> represents one of their
> few desirable commodities and as such would be the
> key to any trade that I
> imagine the Celts may entertain.
> 
> As for Bison Dele, well, I like him as a person. . .
> But seriously, let's
> examine his strengths/weaknesses to see why Boston
> might bite at such an
> offer without descending into pure negativity (isn't
> this all you ask for
> in Pitino's case?). The guy is a "free spirit" - no
> question there. But he
> would also be a major improvement over Eric
> Riley/Dwayne Schintzius/Pervis
> Ellison. Unfortunately Potapenko does pick up his
> share of cheap fouls.
> Also Dele wouldn't need to be the "the man" and in
> fact his career would
> seem to indicate that he plays better when he is not
> expected to be "the
> man". Detroit (read Doug Collins) screwed up "big
> time" when they tried to
> make Dele something he isn't - a dominating starting
> center - and measured
> against such expectations Dele was bound to fail, as
> he has. But as a
> hustling scrub filling in off the bench Dele could
> provide some important
> minutes and - unlike Coleman - Bison wouldn't sulk
> about it. Now you ask,
> isn't nearly 5mil a lot of cash for a back-up C/PF?
> Objectively, the answer
> is yes - but we need to remember, its not much more
> than what we're already
> paying our back-up PG! In essence we'd be talking
> about a swap of one
> overpaid sub (more easily replaced --> Damon Jones)
> for another (less
> easily replaced --> Eric Riley?) as part of the
> price of prying Jerome
> Williams from the Pistons.
> 
> Now, I hope you don't mistake all the above as
> indicative that I'm
> president of the "Bison Dele fan club" - I'm not.
> But compared to Vin
> Baker, which as you know is a name that has been
> floated as a possibility
> by some well-meaning fans, give me the Bison. For
> all his deficiencies,
> Bison doesn't whine about shots or playing time and
> he comes at half the
> price. Baker has the ego and the contract that comes
> with being named an
> all-star and he hasn't been shy about looking out
> for "number one" as
> Seattle's season sank into Puget sound - in good
> part due to his lack of
> productivity. Bison's not tough but from what I know
> of him he is a team
> player and given the proper role can be a valued
> contributor. 
> 
> Now, let's look at the deal as a whole and ask why
> Pitino might be
> interested in it. Beyond the fact that such a trade
> tallies with the
> indications we can derive from what Holley and
> Pitino have told us, such a
> trade would improve our energy, rebounding,
> toughness (at least in JW's
> case) and depth at PF and C. This would enable
> Pitino to shift Walker to
> the 3-spot for significant minutes a game which
> should benefit both Walker
> and the team as a whole. And it would accomplish all
> this without
> sacrificing one of the four core players Pitino
> started the season with:
> Anderson, Walker, Pierce or Mercer. From Pitino's
> perspective he
> strengthens his team's most glaring weakness at the
> cost of two
> benchwarmers - not bad!
> 
> Why would Detroit sign on? As I mentioned before,
> they need a PG in the
> worst way and Coach Gentry has indicated that he
> feels Barros merits
> consideration as PG. Also, they get to subtract Dele
> and his contract from
> a situation where too much water has already flowed
> over the dam. They
> sacrifice in losing Jerome Williams but do get
> Battie (and all those
> qualities you mentioned) in return to man the
> 4-spot. In sum: they gain a
> starting PG who can relieve Grant Hill of a good
> deal of his ball handling
> responsibilities, thereby benefiting both Hill's
> game and the team as a
> whole, and add a shot-blocking four in exchange for
> an underachieving
> center with a hard-to-move contract and the
> sacrifice of a valuable but not
> core member of the team.
> 
> On another topic: you had to love the Kings stomping
> on the Jazz at home!
> Go Kings!!
> 
> A final note regarding engaging in "groupthink" in
> referring to Pitinocchio
> by "snide names". Lighten up! This is sports we're
> talking about, isn't it?
> If you can't have fun with this, then what can you
> have fun with? After
> all, we don't work for the man - thank God!! Also,
> it is hardly
> "groupthink" if the list is split (which it seems to
> be) fairly evenly
> regarding their assessment of El Presidente. It
> seems a fairly harmless way
> to vent honest frustration with the most repellant
> aspect of Pitino's
> personality as it comes across through his actions
> and statements: his
> desire to manipulate other people and their
> perceptions of him. Like Joe, I
> consider myself a bit of a Pitino-knocker, but not
> for what he has done as
> much as how he does it. The incessant yelling during
> games, the spinning to
> the press, the constant revisions of past history,
> the denial and/or
> inability to own up to certain of his own
> shortcomings (I haven't forgotten
> what he did to young PP!) all are indicative of his
> belief that he can
> manipulate anyone and everyone. I wish the man all
> the luck in the world
> (since his success should be our success) but that
> doesn't mean I have to
> revere each of his personality quirks. And I don't
> buy the line that his
> incessant attempts at manipulation are a necessary
> key 
=== message truncated ===

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