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Re: The Boston Celtics Mailing List Digest V4 #173
I have been seeing people worrying about dropping down in round 2 in the
trade for our GM and wonder why? Round 2 doesn't matter in the NBA draft,
maybe you are thinking this is the NFL.At 01:53 PM 6/1/97 +0000, you wrote:
>
>The Boston Celtics Mailing List Digest
> Sunday, June 1 1997 Volume 04 : Number 173
>
>
>
>In this issue:
>
> dont trade the picks
> Re: Thinking aloud
> Re: CHAMPIONSHIP
> Re: The Boston Celtics Mailing List Digest V4 #171
> Re: SHAWN KEMP ASKS FOR TRADE!
> posibilities
> LOOKING FOR BIRD GAMES ON VIDEO
> A plausible trade.
> Re: SHAWN KEMP ASKS FOR TRADE!
> Trade?
> Re: Trade?
> Re: SHAWN KEMP ASKS FOR TRADE!
> Re: SHAWN KEMP ASKS FOR TRADE!
> Re: Point Guard
> Re: SHAWN KEMP ASKS FOR TRADE!
> Re: possibilities
>
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 09:34:05 -0400 (EDT)
>From: JOzersky@aol.com
>Subject: dont trade the picks
>
>- --Not for elderly stars
>- --Not to unload players -- play them and increase their value or trade them
>for picks or buy them out
>- --not for higher or lower picks. This is our only chance to add young
>talent. We need stars, as Wallace says, not just more "good" players. We
>need a star and a center. It looks as if those two might not be the same
>player right away. but W/foyle and (say) Van Horn, we would have a
>foundation. Trading a pick just to free up free agent money is dumb unless
>you can say for sure that this draft is all busts. And who can?
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 10:42:15 -0700
>From: "JLyell" <jlyell@concentric.net>
>Subject: Re: Thinking aloud
>
>- ----------
>>
>> I think Rick has made up his mind to trade both the picks and that's
>one> reasons why C's are working out players who will be picked within
>10-16th. The 10th belongs to Milwaukee and the 16th to the Clippers which
>forces one to wonder if there is already a trade in works for Vin Baker,
>and if they trade with Cleveland or Dallas or Clippers, who would the C's
>send along to dump some salary with the 6th pick..my hunch is Dana, because
>the Globe reported that both Rick & Red were present during his workout and
>were checking on his rehabilitation. What do you guys think ?
>> -
>> Mishra
>
>
>
>if we move both picks we better get a bonified young star & a potential
>star like Sprewell & Smith. I have mixed feelings on Baker since , if we
>manage the cap correctly we can get him in a year for nothing, why trade
>for him now when we can keep the picks and add him later ? I would rather
>wait & get Mercer, Billups or Van Horn & Baker in a year then get Baker
>now. If they want to throw Ray Allen in some package we should consider
>it. I think Milwaukee, Golden State, Washington, & Indiana have some
>stars but need to make some moves because they are underachieving with
>their current lineups. As far as the Clippers or Dallas, I don't think they
>have anything that could help us that is worth these picks. Cleveland, I
>would consider moving 6 for their 13 & 16 but we better know who we want
>there will be available since we dropped from 31 to 55 in the second round.
>
>
>
>
>>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 10:47:57 -0700
>From: "JLyell" <jlyell@concentric.net>
>Subject: Re: CHAMPIONSHIP
>
>>
>> Hi. Any red blooded basketball fan, no matter what team they root for
>during the year, enjoys the playoffs, I think. I didn't think I cared, but
>have watched parts of most of the games. Am personally hoping the Jazz
>take the championship. And I don't think Malone stole the MVP, I think he
>and this team deserve some recognition. MJ not withstanding, I think they
>just might be the best team right now. It should be a good
>> series.
>> Dorine
>
>Dorine, I agree. Stockton & Malone are two of the class guys in the league
>& it would be good to see them get a ring before they retire. The Houston
>series had some great games. They need to steal one of the first two games
>in Chicago, with Pippen & Kukoc injured they could do this.
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 10:53:49 -0700
>From: "JLyell" <jlyell@concentric.net>
>Subject: Re: The Boston Celtics Mailing List Digest V4 #171
>
>> >
>> >I think the reason the 76ers would be interested in this is that they
>want Mercer, not Battie. Mercer would be available with the 3rd pick if the
>76ers make this trade and with the 6th pick they can grab a big man like
>Foyle or Cato. Thats why I think we shouldn't make this deal if the reason
>for it is that we want Battie, I think he'll be available for #3..
>> >
>
>I think you are correct & Philly would rather have Mercer than Stackhouse,
>but they need a big man & don't want to give the Celtics what they need
>also. No matter what Philly does we really can't be hurt. We either get
>Mercer or Battie, if the guru's think he can be a top NBA big man.
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 10:59:07 -0700
>From: "JLyell" <jlyell@concentric.net>
>Subject: Re: SHAWN KEMP ASKS FOR TRADE!
>
>- ----------
>>
>> Absolutely, Kemp is the best PF in the game today, yes I belive he is
>better than Karl Malone. He is only 26 years old and at the top of his
>game. He also plays Pitino style defence and is great in a fast break type
>of offense..he will be great. Regarding his attitude, have faith, we have a
>great motivator in Rick, he will be able to handle him.
>> -
>> Mishra
>
>Although Kemp is an incredible athlete, I don't know if that makes a team a
>championship team if he brings a poor attitude with him. I also remember
>seeing a report that no matter what age a player starts at, the average
>time in the league is 9-10 years. Kemp has been in what 7-8 ? He could
>play 15, but then he could play 10-11 and this would not help the Celtics.
>He could hit the wall as Dominique Wilkins did after about 10 years.
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 15:45:14 -0400 (EDT)
>From: "Enter Real Name Here (Optional)" <dhaven@ime.net>
>Subject: posibilities
>
>out of all of the possibilities so far, I like the idea of keeping what we
>have. I can picture Dino Radja playing Center, Antoine Walker at Power
>Forward, Eric Williams at Small Forward, with the 3rd pick taking Chauncey
>Billups for Point Gaurd and with the 6th pick taking Tracy McGrady to play
>Shooting Gaurd. I feel that with this team We'd be faster than most teams
>down low and bigger than most teams up front with our Gaurds 6' 3 and 6'8.
>If we had any money left under the salary cap I'd try and get as a free
>agent at Center and or Power Forward as a backup. Does anyone have any
>suggestions for free agents?
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 18:48:26 -0400 (EDT)
>From: Ed Ag <afn15554@afn.org>
>Subject: LOOKING FOR BIRD GAMES ON VIDEO
>
>Fellow Celtics fans --
> I am a collector of video tapes of old Celtics games. I have over 350
>games on tape from the Bird era and even several pre-Bird. Great playoff
>games, Bird scoring explosions, regular season classics, All Star games,
>even several Bird college games. Lots of Bird!
> I am looking for others who might have some old tapes stashed away in
>the closet. Would love to trade for some new games. I am looking primarily
>for games from pre-1986. If you have any tapes and would be interested in a
>trade, please e-mail me. Thanks, Ed
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 17:06:13 -0700
>From: "smishra" <smishra@ix.netcom.com>
>Subject: A plausible trade.
>
>I just finished reading Bob Whitsit's <GM Portalnd Trail Blazers> interview
>in which he was asked the folowing question:
>
>> What do feel are the top priorities to better the Blazers for next
>season? Is it getting a backup point guard or a new > center, re-signing
>Clifford Robinson and/or Chris Dudley or giving contract extensions to
>Rasheed Wallace and Gary > Trent?
>
>> If you just take the team as it is today, the top priority would be
>getting a backup point guard behind Kenny Anderson > and getting another
>big guy that can play some minutes and contribute. If we wanted to get real
>greedy we would > want another shooter, someone that can stroke it from the
>outside.
>
>> The contract dealings are a part of the jigsaw puzzle I get to deal with
>starting June 1. Signing one player can affect > all the other signings.
>Cliff is a free agent and Chris has an option to leave. We definitely will
>sit down and talk with all > of them.
>
>Is it just possible that he is looking for a guy like Dana Barros..who is
>not a front line point guard doesn't desire to be one and also stroke it
>from the outside. Hey! we can give them Dana for free i.e.for a 1st
>rounder <they have two this year 18th and 20th> or for somebody like Gary
>Trent who is due for a contract extension. If this materialises one can
>gladly
>say 1 gone and 2 more to go <Brown and Minor because Radja may appear
>to be overpaid, but he has earned his salary 2 out of last three years>.
> - MIshra
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 22:21:34 +2000 (EDT)
>From: bis@world.std.com (Adi Inbar)
>Subject: Re: SHAWN KEMP ASKS FOR TRADE!
>
>"JLyell" <jlyell@concentric.net> writes:
>> > Absolutely, Kemp is the best PF in the game today, yes I belive he is
>> better than Karl Malone. He is only 26 years old and at the top of his
>> game. He also plays Pitino style defence and is great in a fast break type
>> of offense..he will be great. Regarding his attitude, have faith, we have a
>> great motivator in Rick, he will be able to handle him.
>> > -
>> > Mishra
>>
>> Although Kemp is an incredible athlete, I don't know if that makes a team a
>> championship team if he brings a poor attitude with him. I also remember
>> seeing a report that no matter what age a player starts at, the average
>> time in the league is 9-10 years. Kemp has been in what 7-8 ? He could
>> play 15, but then he could play 10-11 and this would not help the Celtics.
>
>That sounds like one of those meaningless statistics that people like
>to put together and quote. Are you suggesting that Arvydas Sabonis
>and Dean Garrett are just as likely to be in the leage 9-10 years as
>any 21- or 22-year-old drafted in the past two years? What about
>Moses Malone, who started at 19? He lasted, what, 20 seasons? I
>don't know where you read that statistic or how it was determined,
>but I suggest you ignore it. Shawn Kemp is a 26-year-old, and should
>be regarded as such.
>
>> He could hit the wall as Dominique Wilkins did after about 10 years.
>
>Dominique Wilkins was never that good to begin with. Phenomenally
>athletically gifted, but he had a very poor understanding of the game
>and very poor instincts. When his extraordinary leaping ability
>faded, there was nothing left except the fact that he does not know
>how to play basketball.
>
>By the way, I think it's absolutely outrageous to say that Kemp is
>better than Karl Malone. Just *what* does he do better? Slam the
>ball harder?
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 22:48:23 -0400 (EDT)
>From: Jason Gunkel <celticpride@mail-me.com>
>Subject: Trade?
>
>Daniels, Billups,
>Jacque Vaughn of
>
>I just thought of a good trade that is quite possible. Dino Radja and #3
>for Vin Baker and Milwaukee's #10. We would get a great big man and still
>have two good picks left at #6 and #10. I think it is very possible that
>Milwaukee would do this because Baker will probable leave after the season
>and they would get something descent in return for him instead of losing him
>for nothing. I know some of you think we should wait until the end of the
>season and sign Baker as a free agent and that is a good idea, but I think
>it would be better and sign him now. Some team might offer him more money
>than we have available. Also, it seams that the Celtics might be going to
>make some kind of trade similar to this one. They have been working out
>players such as Billups, Daniels, Vaughn, McGrady, and Taylor who are
>expected to go anywhere from 6 to 15.
>
>I think it would be a good trade for both teams and it might happen. What
>does everybody think?
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 20:50:11 -0700
>From: "JLyell" <jlyell@concentric.net>
>Subject: Re: Trade?
>
>- ----------
>> From: Jason Gunkel
>>
>I just thought of a good trade that is quite possible. Dino Radja and #3
>for Vin Baker and Milwaukee's #10. We would get a great big man and still
>have two good picks left at #6 and #10. I think it is very possible that
>Milwaukee would do this because Baker will probable leave after the season
>and they would get something descent in return for him instead of losing
>him for nothing. I know some of you think we should wait until the end of
>the season and sign Baker as a free agent and that is a good idea, but I
>think it would be better and sign him now. Some team might offer him more
>money than we have available. Also, it seams that the Celtics might be
>going to make some kind of trade similar to this one.
>> I think it would be a good trade for both teams and it might happen.
>
>What does everybody think?
>
> Before we go after Baker we need to know how much he is wanting on a long
>term contract. If he wants $10M a year like Mourning & Howard I say forget
>it, he isn't worth that much. But it might be smart to trade & make it
>dependent on him signing a multi-year contract so he is not on the market
>at the end of the year and no matter how much he likes Boston, simply
>unable to turn down a ridiculous $10M a year contract offer from someone
>who has the cap room & money to burn. Especially when teams are giving the
>likes of Jim Macilvaine $5M a year for 5 points a game !
>
>Milwaukee need to look at all options because Baker will be gone, & he
>isn't happy there.
>
>
>I would sweeten the pot and give Radja & Williams or Minor & the 3, for
>Baker & 10. You need a 3 that can shoot the outside J in the NBA, I now
>think it is best to move Williams & keep Fox if he is serious, for say $2M
>a year plus incentive bonuses. I like the idea of getting Baker, Daniels,
>McGrady, Van Horn, or Thomas at 6 & maybe Knight, Anderson, or Cory Carr at
>10 or move 10 to Cleveland for 13 & 16 & possibly take 2 of Anderson,
>Carr, Honeycutt, Croshere, Shammgod, Bobby Jackson, Kebu Stewert. or Scot
>Pollard.
>
>I have a feeling Pitino wants Derek Anderson but doesn't want to take him
>to early.
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sun, 1 Jun 1997 14:10:41 +1000
>From: "Alan Patterson" <apatt@hawknet.com.au>
>Subject: Re: SHAWN KEMP ASKS FOR TRADE!
>
>- ----------
>> From: Adi Inbar <bis@world.std.com>
>> To: celtics@igtc.com
>> Subject: Re: SHAWN KEMP ASKS FOR TRADE!
>> Date: Saturday, 31 May 1997 12:21
>>
>>
>> By the way, I think it's absolutely outrageous to say that Kemp is
>> better than Karl Malone. Just *what* does he do better? Slam the
>> ball harder?
>>
>>
>Kemp could be averaging about 27 points too if john stocton was on his
>team. Karl Malone would be about a 12 points a game person without
>stockton. Besides kemp is a better shot-blocker and rebounder.
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 22:44:56 -0700
>From: "smishra" <smishra@ix.netcom.com>
>Subject: Re: SHAWN KEMP ASKS FOR TRADE!
>
>> By the way, I think it's absolutely outrageous to say that Kemp is
>> better than Karl Malone. Just *what* does he do better? Slam the
>> ball harder?
>>
>
>No it is not outrageous, all you have to do is take a look at the Seattle
>vs Utah where Kemp plays Malone straight up and Utah always has a tough
>time beating seattle. Besides Kemp is quicker and a better shot blocker.
> - Mishra
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sun, 1 Jun 1997 07:07:05 -0500
>From: gh18@juno.com (Gregory Hurst)
>Subject: Re: Point Guard
>
>On Fri, 30 May 1997 20:58:27 -0700 "JLyell" <jlyell@concentric.net>
>writes:
>>
>>
>>----------
>>> From: Michael Joseph Byrnes <mbyrnes@leland.Stanford.EDU>
>>> To: Jim McMaster <mcmaster@sweng.stortek.com>
>>> Cc: celtics@igtc.COM
>>> Subject: Re: Point Guard
>>> Date: Friday, May 30, 1997 11:21 AM
>>>
>>> On Fri, 30 May 1997, Jim McMaster wrote:
>>>
>>> > In message
>><Pine.GSO.3.96.970529190133.1556C-100000@elaine11.Stanford.EDU>,
>>> > Mic
>>> > hael Joseph Byrnes said:
>>> > >
>>> > > JLyell wrote:
>>> > >
>>> > > > It also looks like resigning Wesley may
>>> > > > not happen so do we have to take Billups or Antonio Daniels ?
>>Who
>>else is going to play point Barros ? Brown ? I don't think so.
>>> > >
>>> > > Why not?
>>> > >
>>> > Because neither one can play the point, silly...they are both
>>miserable
>
>If Rick Pitino`s style of play is the same, which is to push the ball up
>the floor,shoot the three and pass to a guy coming off of a screen? I
>think Dee and Dana can contribute. Rick`s style is a Tony Delk type
>player, a former point guard that won a national championship. This
>should tell you the type point guard he is looking for.
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sun, 1 Jun 1997 07:18:22 -0500
>From: gh18@juno.com (Gregory Hurst)
>Subject: Re: SHAWN KEMP ASKS FOR TRADE!
>
>>No F%@&#!* way ! Kemp and his agent are just a pair of dumb shits !
>>I
>>didn't seem them whining when they signed the long term contract !
>>Now
>>they want to re-negotiate, tough shit. They should let this happen
>>when
>>they let teams re-negotiate down with overpaid bums like Derrrick
>>Coleman,
>>Alonzo Mourning, Juwan Howard, Shawn Bradley, Jim Mcilvaine, Dana
>>Barros,
>>Dee Brown etc.
>>>
>>>
>>> The players and the agents are very intelligent. Every hard working
>american wants to paid well, whether he/she is a School Teacher , Doctor,
>Engineer, or Custodian. I think if you could go in and demand the same
>type salary from your employer, you would. The key is, you must have an
>employer that thinks you are worth the money or the employer must have no
>clue on what is going on a pays the money. I don`t blame the players, I
>blame Management. --
>>>
>>>
>>> Greg
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> GO CELTICS!!!!! GO BRUINS!!!! GO RED SOX!!!! GO BRUINS!!!! GO
>>CELTICS!!!!
>>
>>> GO RED SOX!!!!! GO PATRIOTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>>> ***Member of the Reggie Lewis Club***
>>> ***Member of the Larry Bird Club*** ***Member of the
>>John
>>> Valentin***
>>> ***Member of the Antione Walker Club*** ***Member of the Tim
>>
>>> Naerhing***
>>> ***Member of the Anson Carter Club***
>>
>>> ***Member of the Cammeron Mann Club***
>>
>>> ***Member of the Steve Heinze Club***
>>> ***Member of the Ted Donato Club***
>>> ***Member of the Jozef Stumpel Club***
>>> ***Member of the Mo Vaughn Club***
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sun, 1 Jun 1997 06:23:16 -0500
>From: gh18@juno.com (Gregory Hurst)
>Subject: Re: possibilities
>
>On Sat, 31 May 1997 15:45:14 -0400 (EDT) "Enter Real Name Here
>(Optional)" <haven't@ime.net> writes:
>>out of all of the possibilities so far, I like the idea of keeping
>>what we
>>have. I can picture Dino Radja playing Center, Antoine Walker at
>>Power
>>Forward, Eric Williams at Small Forward, with the 3rd pick taking
>>Chauncey
>>Billups for Point Gaurd and with the 6th pick taking Tracy McGrady to
>>play
>>Shooting Gaurd. I feel that with this team We'd be faster than most
>>teams
>>down low and bigger than most teams up front with our Guards 6' 3 and
>>6'8.
>>If we had any money left under the salary cap I'd try and get as a
>>free
>>agent at Center and or Power Forward as a backup. Does anyone have
>>any
>>suggestions for free agents?
>>
>>
>>I agree, why should we trade players like Dino, Dana, and Dee before
>they are given a chance under a new system. These guys can make major
>contributions if given the right situation. Every game that I have saw
>Dino play, he has given the opposing players problems. He caused Shaq
>all types of problems, because he can take his man off the dribble, shoot
>the medium range shot, block shots, and is tough in the low post. Dee,
>before he got feed up with the old system was playing like a future
>allstar. He can defend, shoot the three, block shots, hustle, take his
>man off the dribble, and will defend the opposing one or two guard. Then
>one will say " well he can`t guard a Jordan or Reggie Miller? Hell, Who
>can ? But he would also cause match up problems for the opposing team.
>Dana, is for sure needed in the Pitino system. Do you remember these
>names of former players that came off the bench to simply shoot and cause
>havoc for the opposing teams "Down Town Freddie Brown and The Microwave"?
> I think the Dana can do the same thing for Boston. Every Champion must
>have a few solid role players ( Boston in the Eighties had the best
>starting five in all of Basketball. However, NO BENCH and that denied
>Bird and the crew a possibility of three additional championships).
>Give the guys a chance. I would hate to see these guys come back to
>hurt us. If they are given a chance and fail, then trade them. By the
>way, who do we have that can guard Dino, if we traded him today? I think
>he would score at will.
>
>------------------------------
>
>End of The Boston Celtics Mailing List Digest V4 #173
>*****************************************************
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