Re: A simple statement from this male. An a "long" one from this one.

["?????" <elbo@xxxxxxxxx>]

Hey guys, why argue about God? Do you think he needs you, or the great great
great Pete Townshend to prove his exsistence? No matter what any of us
thinks, He is. It takes time to realize it, and sometimes it takes a Meg
Patterson or somebody else, for God doesn`t come down on a cloud, telling
you
that the way you`re walking is wrong... He works thru people and
circumstances, that`s what i believe. Only he`s not a goody God who`ll
always do as we people please. The universe has it`s laws beyond the
scientific ones that we know, and we`ll never be able to embrace them. See
God has no limits and no definition.
 But I don`t want to try to persuade
anyone in anything. it`s not my job. But still it`s strange to me that you
Scott (no offence, that`s what you once said) say the who`s a religion (and
who`s the god then? rog or pete?) that needs deciples and messengers...
wonder why you can so easily believe in what a bunch of people (extremely
talented, yes, but still mortal and sinful) does and worship it and deny the
true God? And don`t mix things up. God is not religion and religion is NOT
God. It`s about faith, faith in something bigger. You say that the *bigger*
doesn`t excist because there`s so much *bad shit* in this world. It`s the
duality of the world we live in. We are the reflection of this world and
this world is the reflection of what we are. And if you bother to read the
book of revelation, you might find images and hints about  why there`s so
much mess in the world today (you don`t have to turn your who music off to
do that.) Anyways, every human heart needs faith. If you don`t believe in
God, you still believe in something - yourself (I don`t believe in
Jesus,.... I believe in me (John Lennon)), yourself, your friends, your
country, your career, your favorite band, Tolkien, Harry Potter - any
substitute will do. If we`re looking for substitutes for God, it means
something, doesn`t it? You won`t want a substitute for 'something that
doesn`t excist'. You won`t feel the emptyness where nothing is actually
missing and won`t want to be filled up. And if you really want to know the
TRUTH about everything, including pete and his ups and downs, and your own,
and the whole world`s - ask God whatever questions you have. If He`s there,
He`ll hear, and He`ll answer and you will understand.( I am not trying to
seem smart, i am telling this from my very heart and this i believe to my
soul and i`ve experienced it, too.)
I think i said too much anyway i wanted to share.
LOVE REIGN O`ER YOU!!!

----- Original Message -----
From: "ACLGC" <antonioclaudiocerqueira@yahoo.com.br>
To: <thewho@igtc.com>
Sent: Friday, October 25, 2002 7:01 PM
Subject: Re: A simple statement from this male. An a "long" one from this
one.


> BRAHMAVID BRAHMAIVA BHAVATHI is a Vedian statement
> that means something like "We are so great as what we
> believe and learn", what implies that if you believe
> in God and learn truthfully about God you turn in God
> in the end, someway. It's a matter of faith, after
> all. And God blesses who has faith, this one is a
> privileged.
>
> P.S.: Pete Towshend has already had faith but today,
> IMHO, he losts almost everything of he believed one
> day. Sad, sad, sad...
>
>  --- Scott Schrade <schrade@akrobiz.com> escreveu: > >
> There is a universal current that is there and if
> > our switch is "off" we will
> > > not receive the benefit of it's power.
> >
> > That's utter nonsense.  I could just as easliy say
> > that *scientific* truth is out
> > there & if your "switch" is off you will not receive
> > the benefit of its knowledge.
> >
> > > You can argue with this,
> >
> > Tell me about it.....
> >
> > > but no one will ever convince me with "facts"
> > taken from a sliver of infor-
> > > mation by people that do not know the *whole*
> > story that try to sum up the
> > > entire history of the universe.
> >
> > Sure, why pay attention to the facts when you can
> > put your faith in fairy tales
> > made up by sexist, oppressive men thousands of years
> > ago.
> >
> > > *Who* got Pete off of Heroin?
> >
> > Pete, himself, with the help of Meg Patterson.
> > Obviously you're implying that
> > some sort of "higher power" had a hand in it but I
> > could just as easily claim that
> > this "higher power" got Pete hooked on heroin in the
> > first place.  Or was that
> > Higher Power's arch enemy Mr. Devil?
> >
> > > Who stopped him from killing himself?
> >
> > Pete put a stop to his destructive behaviour.  Who
> > gave him the self-destruct-
> > ive tendencies in the first place?  If your God
> > created him, then he created him
> > imperfectly.  On purpose.  Nice deity.
> >
> > > What power got him off of the bottle?  I want to
> > know this.
> >
> > What power let him get hooked on the bottle in the
> > first place?  I want to know
> > *that.*  Your reasoning is flawed.  Your God is
> > there each time to help Pete
> > overcome his problems yet He seems conspicuously
> > absent each time Pete gets
> > fucked up on something.  Odd.  Or is that all part
> > of God's "grand scheme?"
> >
> > > It is my right to know this.
> >
> > I'm trying to explain it to you but I think your
> > "switch" is off.
> >
> > > Who stopped the demons that drove Keith for the
> > period that he listened to
> > > Meg Patterson when he played drums better without
> > *them* while she went
> > > on the road with him?
> >
> > Ah.  *That* time it was the Hindu God Vishnu.  Not
> > the Christian God.  The
> > Christian God was too busy helping Eric Clapton.
> >
> > > Then came the temporary success with his problem.
> > I believe that his soul
> > > was saved there. What mercy.
> >
> > "What mercy?!"  Your God allowed him to get back on
> > the bottle, keep pop-
> > ping pills, & eventually die!  Thanks, God.  Great
> > job.  You cleaned Moon up
> > for a few months & then abandoned him.
> >
> > And you're saying God picked a time when Moon was
> > sober to "save" his soul?
> > What's the matter?  Don't want to imagine Moonie
> > burning in the pits of Hell?
> > Pretty convenient.
> >
> > > I believe He may have received the Life into him
> > that *conquered* every-
> > > thing that tortured him. But later he turned the
> > switch back off.
> >
> > If the "switch" was off when he died then that means
> > he goes to hell, right?
> > Your religious beliefs seem to ironically conform to
> > your hopes.  Odd.  You're
> > never wrong then.  How comforting.
> >
> > > My announcement is that heroin is *no* match for
> > Jesus.
> >
> > You're right there!  There are many more people
> > fucked up on Jesus than there
> > are fucked up on heroin!
> >
> > > It has been thoroughly proven to me so many times
> > that I laugh when people
> > > suggest it is just a coincidence or superstition.
> >
> > Now *that's* arrogant!  Woe to the poor, foolish
> > nonbelievers.  Aren't we stu-
> > pid for having our "switches" off.
> >
> > > The reason for my rant is not to push some
> > religion off on all of you.
> >
> > No, not at all.
> >
> > > I  hope that these few years have shown that I am
> > not one of those types.
> >
> > That past few months haven't.
> >
> > > I hate religion.  I hate it because God hates it.
> >
> > Met him, have you?  Ask him where I put my car keys.
> >
> > > It is a counterfeit that causes people not to
> > believe in God.  It is also very
> > > boring.
> >
> > Yeah, who wants to get up early on Sunday & go to
> > church?  It's much easier
> > to make up your own religion which conveniently
> > conforms to your pre-establish-
> > ed beliefs.  No sermons to sit through.
> >
> > > Creation itself proves that Whoever created it is
> > not boring!
> >
> > By that reasoning it also proves that whoever
> > created it is not perfect either.
> > Your "Creator" gave us such lovely things as cancer,
> > the Washington sniper,
> > al-Qaeda, Hitler, earthquakes, Bon Jovi, famine,
> > disease, poverty, child abuse,
> > & ringworm.  Real nice guy there.
> >
> > > Michaelangelo's paintings are great, but they just
> > cause me to appreciate
> > > Michaelangelo.
> >
> > Nature is great & causes me to appreciate Nature.
> > No God is needed (un-
> > less your "switch" is off).
> >
> > > There is no pain like being misunderstood and no
> > one has been misunderstood
> > > more than the true God.
> >
> > It's kinda hard *not* to misunderstand something
> > THAT DOESN'T EXIST!!!!!
> >
> > >  It is rather plain for me to see that Kurt Cobain
> > did not go to this One for
> > > help in his final moments.
> >
> > Then why didn't God come to *him* as you claim he
> > did for Pete on several
> > occasions?  God wasn't a Nirvana fan?
> >
> > > Not the forum for this kind of talk? I agree in
> > part that is why I avoid it.
> > > But some things need to be discussed at least
> > once.
> >
> > Nothing wrong with stating your beliefs & opinions.
> > I respect that.  But if I
> > get to hear your's, you get hear mine.
> >
> > > Others are affected by what we do. That is the
> > reason I am revealing this
> > > secret to you guys.
> >
> > I appreciate your candor, Jon.  I really do.  Sounds
> > like you've battled through
> > some heavy duty shit.  But instead of crediting your
> > recovery to some "higher
> > power," I choose to credit *you,* as an individual.
> > Because I know that deep
> > down there isn't any God.  *You* pulled yourself out
> > of your mess.  Don't sell
> > yourself short.  Be your own God.
> >
> > > If Kurt had heard and believed in the "fact,"
> > salvation would have been his
> > > experience. This is one of the greatest principles
> > we will ever hear.
> >
> > Nah.  Modern science has plenty more astounding
> > principles than that.  Nature
> > itself is much more fascinating & compelling than
> > the dogma of all Man's re-
> > ligions combined.
> >
> > Trusting in science isn't turning your back on
> > anything.  It's simply facing up
> > to the wonders of reality.  Check it out.  Turn your
> > "switch" on first, though.
> >
> >
> > - SCHRADE in Akron
>
> _______________________________________________________________________
> Yahoo! GeoCities
> Tudo para criar o seu site: ferramentas faceis de usar, espago de sobra e
acesssrios.
> http://br.geocities.yahoo.com/