amck at thenetdr.com
Mon Mar 26 00:25:21 CDT 2007
> From: "Jim M" <nakedi at comcast.net>
> Date: March 24, 2007 6:21:57 PM CDT
>> Maybe you'd prefer this, all 75 minutes of The Great Global Warming
>> Swindle, thoughtfully put on Google video:
> If you do, make sure you first check out how the film misrepresents
> the opinions of at least one of the experts in it.
Here's better than that -- Wunsch's letter itself, not a bunch of
I still think the Great Swindle is well worth watching and presents
> From: "Kevin and Tania O'Neal" <kevinandt at gmavt.net>
> Date: March 25, 2007 8:46:01 AM CDT
>> The producer, being both British and a former if not current Marxist,
>> is clearly not a Republican, so cannot be dismissed out of hand.
> Hey, I never said all idiots and distorters are Republican.
> Just seems that way.
<rimshot> Try the veal.
Actually, it was JOELLTE I recall as dismissing Republicans as a such.
> Oh, come on.
> No one is advocating starvation. That would be against the overall
> goal of this.....survival.
> But, don't we need to do something?
IF global warming is something we have any control over.
> It is unquestionably and abundantly clear that it is the weakness
> of our Government (run by the people, remember, so us ourselves)
> for continually allowing policy to be set (PURCHASED!!!) by those
> capitalists who's only goal is to maintain the status quo.....AKA
> profit margins.
> It's what we call Capitalism run amuck.
You may call it that. I say we've never had true capitalism. What
capitalism we had has been slowly receding since the 1890's and being
replaced by an uneasily mixed economy, slowly advancing toward
socialism. Unfortunately, perhaps because the US was founded as a
capitalist country, capitalism takes the hit for the negative aspects
in the popular consciousness, and usually gets credit for the
advances only grudgingly if at all.
> And, the reason it is allowed to continue is because we are a
> selfish, greedy society.
I wish we had more selfishness and greed, properly defined, in the
> We do not own this planet.
> We are care takers.
For whom? This is probably the heart of our disagreement. I think
humans do (or should) own the planet, and shape it toward their own
wellbeing. That doesn't rule out untouched wilderness, if anyone
wants to buy and preserve it (as The Nature Conservancy, e.g., is
doing), but it does imply letting the market determine its value. I
also disagree with the idea that everything was just great until
humans got a toehold and messed things up. I don't believe in the
innate evil of mankind nor in original sin.
> Get out of the way if you are [defeated].
> Let the people who aren't save you and the rest of us.
Can you do it without making me buy carbon credits in addition to the
plane tickets if I want to fly to a Who show or 6?
> And, by the way....people don't take much better care of property,
> houses or mountains just because they own them.
> You should have seen Vermont only 60 years ago.
> All the trees were gone.
> That's not an exaggeration......."All the trees were gone."
> Those private property owners, with their wallets needing filling,
> clear cut the entire state.
They clearcut it because they valued what could be done with the
trees more than leaving them in place. The economic growth those
trees provided helped make it possible for you to live there, 60
years later (infrastructure and such). Apparently you, 60 years
later, prefer the views, hikes, etc. with trees. They didn't have
that luxury. A voluntary transaction like that means that not only
are both parties better off than they were before the trade, but if
the transaction results in a profit the whole system (e.g., the
people who can buy houses with that lumber in them) has a greater
standard of living, because profit means an inefficiency in the
economy has been removed. If you had land with trees, you should
welcome others selling theirs, as it will raise the value of your
tree-filled land -- whether you choose not to sell them or not.
"the average Texan...carries not just a gun but a SHOTGUN." --Pete
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