The Who's reputation

L. Bird pkeets at
Fri Jul 23 08:09:58 CDT 2004

>>I think it's the ideal word, too.  I just think it IS ideal because it's a 
>>very general word that covers a broad array of feelings not necessarily 
>>related to Christianity or even to a Christian type of God.

>Is there someone here that you think doesn't get that?

Aren't you questioning the general usage of it below?

>>How do you think we're bending the word?  Is this an unusual use of it?

>Any definition that does not relate to the supernatural and divine or tries 
>to include purely observational experiences.

Then how are secular humanists to discuss their spiritual feelings?  I agree 
that spiritual isn't just observational.  The spiritual capacity is 
something that's wired into the human brian, and it doesn't go away when 
someone intellectually rejects something as supernatural.

>>I'm not trying to sterilize it.  I'm just trying to include that first man
>who ever looked up at the stars and said "How wonderful they are!  What do
>you suppose makes them turn like that?"  It takes us back to a time when
>science, religion, mathematics and philosophy were all the same and there
>was no division between.

>Right, but originally man's only explanations were that *beings* had put
those things there.  If anything, we've been getting less spiritual.

I agree.  The way we live tends to remove us from nature, and we begin to 
see the world as man-made and to lose touch with our origins, and with 
matters of the spirit.

>But, is it really important?  Whatever word we used, I thought the 
>discussion was whether Pete's songs are about *his* god.

Hmmm.  How did we get into this discussion?  Maybe it's necessary to clairfy 
why it is that I see spirituality in some of Pete's songs that Mark doesn't 
see at all.

It's possible that we could say Pete is talking about morality when he talks 
about a good life or a bad life, and that he's talking about psychological 
ajustment in QUAD, but I think these things he's presenting relate to the 

Is that why we're dicussing definitions?  Does Pete have to mention the 
divine or supernatural in order to write a spiritual song?  Or does he only 
have to arouse spiritual feelings in the listener?


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