REM, Beatles, Glow Girls, Long Digests, & Jim Carrey

[Marc/Carolyn Hurwitz <MHurwitz@compuserve.com>]

Leo:

>its back to the rugby pitch with Carolyn...<

Back?  I've never played rugby in my entire life...tough lot, though;
if you can survive a plane crash in the Andes, you can do anything.

>>1.  R.E.M. is NOT an overrated band! 

"Are too!  Nyah!"<

Ah, I see...an *intellectual* debate.  Well, it beats some disputes
I've seen. <g>
 
>>They are the best group of the past 20 years

Ridiculous.  Countless groups are and were better:  The Police,<

They could've been another Beatles (or Who, Mark) if they hadn't
imploded at the height of their creativity.  And Sting's solo work...what
a heartbreak that is.  But too short a life span.
 
>The Pretenders<

Had two-and-a-half great albums and then fell apart.  Nope.

>Squeeze<

Singles band.  A great one, but still.

>Cracker, The Cure<

Ah, it all comes clear now.  We're obviously arguing from two
entirely different planets.

>Peter Gabriel<

Not a band.  Damn great solo artist, tho.  Amazing how both his
work and Genesis's improved drastically after he split.

>And lastly,
when both bands were at their peak, REM never touched U2, the best band of
the
80s (their post-Joshua Tree nonsense notwithstanding).<

U2 was/is another incredibly erratic group in terms of quality.  Yes,
JOSHUA
TREE is fantastic, as well as BOY, but everything else is a few gems
surrounded
by dreck, or else complete dreck (their last two records).  On the whole,
REM's
work is far better.

>>probably the best American group *ever*

God no!!  Creedence!<

Singles band, plus short life span.

>The Allman Brothers!<

Great instrumentalists, but I can do without a group that thinks a
30 minute jam on one song is a good thing.

>The Byrds!<

Definitely an influence on REM, I admit, but short life span (speaking
of the original configuration) plus highly erratic quality.

>The Velvet Underground!  Lou Reed!<

Velvets were great (and another influence), but Reed can't sing
worth a damn and has a lot to answer for in terms of "journalistic"
songwriting.  Besides, half his material sucks on his own.

>Not to mention Jimi Hendrix!!! (and I consider the
Experience mainly American since Jimi was the creative force).<

I will get creamed for saying this, but if you take away Jimi's
fantastic guitar playing (and Noel and Mitch's superb work as
well), his songwriting is pretty weak.  We'll never know how much
it might've improved.  Besides, he was more of a solo artist than
a band.

>Many bands can debatably lay claim to the title
"Best American Group Ever", but REM will
never be in that race.  Bite your tongue!<

OK...*OUCH*!!
(pause)
REM ith thtill the greatetht group in the U.ETH. A., Leo.    

>What's the famous line, (paraphrased horribly), 'I despise your viewpoint,
but
I will defend to the death your right to say it (and my right to lambaste
it
in return).  BTW, I'm on the fence about Who's Next and Quad myself.<

Whoops, that was a mistake:  I meant to say THE WHO BY NUMBERS.
It's the brain drain...my brain is draining.  But yeah, a debate can be
fun if it's not taken too seriously. ;-)

Mark:

>> But the Who better
> than the Beatles?  Man, think about what you're saying
> for a minute...as good as, of course, but *better*?  Surely
> not!

Definitely, and without any doubt or hesitation.

There have been LOTS of bands better than The Beatles. They started off,
after all, as no more than a British Beach Boys.

Do you really want to have this conversation? I mean, think of what it
could lead to!<

Christ, NO!  It's hard enough defending REM.  Besides, I cannot
comprehend your viewpoint...it's like encountering someone
who sincerely believes that the earth is flat, or the moon landings
were faked, or Bill Clinton didn't lie.  But OK, whatever; just to
save a big long drawn-out argument, I give to both you and Leo.
The Who is the greatest group ever, and REM sucks.  Guess I'll
have to throw out all my REM records, including the autographed
RECKONING LP I got back in '84.  Not to mention my Beatles records.
Must've been kidding myself all those years...all that endless studying
of Beatles books wasted...better pitch them too.

(Don't worry....I'm not serious. <g>)

Jim:

>Again, I just want to thank the Who ladies (GlowGirls,Anne, Carolyn, 
et.al.) for giving me hope for my romantic future.<

Thank you, although I'm not an official GG...too old.  As far
as romance goes, I'm also married, as you may have guessed
(to a man who loves the Beatles, REM AND the Who).  Perhaps
if you were Jim from Hollywood instead of Jim from Chicago....

Two last requests:  People, PLEASE; there is no need to
quote ALL the material that we've seen countless times
before!  Have mercy!  A few lines from the last go-round is
sufficient to refresh my memory.

And finally, just DON'T ANYONE try to persuade me that
Jim Carrey didn't deserve his Golden Globe for Best
Actor...even I have my limits!!

--Carolyn
"How's it going to end?"