Re: CBW review, 2003-4 gm 4, Celtics vs. Pistons

["Dan Forant" <dforant1@xxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Snoop, your assessment of Pierce left out the he messed up again in crunch
time.....turnovers, and ill advised shots....

DanF

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Snoopy the Celtics Beagle" <snoopy@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <Celtics@xxxxxxxx>; <Celticsstuffgroup@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, November 06, 2003 4:33 AM
Subject: CBW review, 2003-4 gm 4, Celtics vs. Pistons


> 2003-04 season game 4, Celtics vs. Detroit Pistons, Wednesday, Nov 5, 2003
>
> Games like this one are very tough to lose.  The Celtics didn't get blown
> out, it was a close one most of the way.
>
> But for the love of Peanuts, all Billups had to do was glance at the hoop
> and another three went in.  Someone needs to just slap Rick Pitino for
> letting Billups go--ah, metaphorically, that is.
>
> C's fans, myself included, felt good coming into this game.  Boston had a
> few days off after watching the New Orleans Hornets dismantle the C's with
> a press to practice how to get the ball over halfcourt properly.  The
> Pistons are normally not what you'd call a great offensive team, and Eric
> Williams, thank goodness, had only a bone bruise from which he expects to
> recover in about 1-2 weeks.
>
> I can't report on Gorman's and Heinsohn's comments, since DirecTV had the
> Detroit feed, But I do have a few comments for Fox Sports Net in general
> before we get to the game.
>
> We know that "Master and Commander" is about to hit the theatres. We know
> that it's a Fox film.  I, for one, am well and truly tired of your obvious
> directive that the team broadcasters must somehow tie in a movie about
> warships in Napoleonic times with a basketball game today.  You went so
far
> overboard that your Detroit team--in keeping with this pitiful attempt at
a
> nautical theme--announced that the Celtics came from the Back Bay.
>
> It's the North End, you Ship of Fools (that's a John Renbourn reference,
if
> you care).
>
> Also, your team in Detroit has the same problem as FSNE in Boston.  The
one
> where they keep cutting to a slow motion replay at the expense of what's
> actually happening now.  If you want to replay everything we just saw,
> fine.  Cut down on the commercials and we'll watch happily.  Otherwise,
let
> us watch the game in peace.  Now, let's hoist the Mains and heave to,
> heading for the stormy waters of the game.
>
> See how annoying that is after one sentence?  Imagine how WE felt after
> several unending scenes of that.
>
> Ok, rant over.
>
> First Quarter:
>
> The Celtics went with a starting lineup of Vin Baker and Kedrick Brown at
> Forward, Mike James and Paul Pierce at Guard, and Mark Blount at
> Center.  The Pistons sent forth Ben Wallace and Tayshaun Prince at
Forward,
> Chauncey Billups and Richard Hamilton at Guard, and Elden Campbell at
Center.
>
> The opening tip--which took quite some time as the ref was apparently
> posing for pictures--was won by Wallace, though Blount made a valiant
> effort.  Pierce made a well-timed block and then came up with the loose
> ball, which he promptly passed upcourt to James.
>
> James then tried to drive to the hoop, but Billups poked the ball away,
> which bounced off Mark Blount and right into the hands of
> Billups.  Chauncey launched a three--one of his few misses, and Wallace
> tipped the rebound, but the James snagged it and launched a great pass up
> to a zooming Kedrick Brown.
>
> I can't understand why things happened the way the did next.  Kedrick had
> his man beat, and was past the free throw line on his way to an easy
> two.  All he had to do was take it up strong and keep his back to his
> would-be defender.  But Kedrick never got any lift off the floor.  He
ended
> up trying to lay it up and in as he went by the hoop.  That allowed his
> defender to foul him on the shot, which ended up a miss.
>
> I KNOW that Kedrick CAN elevate.  But he did not, that time, not even
> close.  He was running hard, but his attempt at a any kind of altitude was
> a total failure.  There's something wrong with him, physically.  There HAS
> to be.  This wasn't confusion, or hesitation.  He was running and
preparing
> to do what he'd been doing all preseason, leap over tall defenders in a
> single bound while pushing the ball through the hoop from above.  Nothing
> happened.
>
> At least he made up for it at the free throw line, making both.  On the
> next trip up, Kedrick worked the land and got a nice hoop off a pass from
> Pierce.  But again, there was no real leaping evident on Brown's
> part.  Heck, CHARLIE Brown could have gone higher.
>
> Well, you knew THAT was coming, right?  Celtics Beagle, and all?  Ok, ok.
>
> The C's were now up 4-zip and we were a minute and a half into the
> quarter.  That's my kind of game so far.  The C's played good defense, but
> Prince hit a deep two over Pierce.  As this happened, the announcers were
> going on interminably about how Walker was no longer with Boston.
>
> There's about 2 dozen teams we haven't played yet this season.  Are we
> going to hear that every time the opposing team gets the broadcast?  Mike
> and Tommy are looking better and better already.  :>)
>
> Pierce got off another nice pass to Vin Baker, who nailed the
> jumper.  Comeback Player?  At the rate he's improving, he may end the
> season as an MVP candidate!  I know it's still a longshot now, but what's
> life without some long range goals?
>
> As the Pistons brought it up, you could hear Coach O'Brien hollering a
> warning to the C's to watch for the back door play.  They did so, but
> Prince hit what was to become the Celtics' bane this night: the three
point
> shot.  There must be something in the water, because suddenly, everyone's
> offense THIS season is just like Boston's was LAST season.  Lots of
> one-and-done threes.  The main difference is these guys are hitting them
at
> an absolutely ridiculous rate.
>
> Pierce then got an open look from the free throw line, hitting the kind of
> shot we'd all like to see more often.
>
> Mark Blount then got the ball and passed it up to Mike James.  James got
it
> to Baker.  Vin got stuffed by Wallace, and went to the line.  Why is it,
by
> the way, that everyone on the C's can make the long pass upcourt except
the
> point guards?  Anyway, Vinnie hit both free throws.
>
> Blount then intercepted a pass and the C's were off and running once
> more.  Pierce made a great pass to baker, who was totally alone on his
side
> of the court for an easy hoop.  Then Kedrick got called for what I thought
> was kind of a cheap foul.  But Brown looked a bit down on himself.
>
> On the next play, Blount gave Billups what could easily have been called a
> hard foul.  Mark has a very physical game, but his habit of swinging that
> arm down is going to get him in hot water if he's not careful. Yet, on the
> next trip up, Mark showed restraint--and patience, as Battie made a VERY
> dangerous pass cross court to Pierce, whose subsequent shot looked queasy
> at the hoop. Blount got in perfect position for the cleanup rebound, but
> was careful not to interfere, as the ball bounced gently through the hoop.
>
> This made it 14-7 in favor of the Good Guys with 7:23 left in the quarter.
>
> The C's defense looked quite good throughout, with strong help defense and
> quick hands.  The offense was looking good, as passes were crisp and
> players took good shots.  The general good feelings on the court were
> marred only as Kedrick picked up his second foul and sat.  Welsch came out
> and immediately got scored on by Hamiltion.
>
> But James got stripped as he got caught waving the ball around with co
> clear plan what to do.  This led to a fast two for the Pistons.  James was
> reading the court better than the last game, but still has a ways to go.
>
> The C's defense was generally good, though, forcing Detroit to the
> outside.  At the other end, Jiri Welsch nailed a three on a nice kick out
> pass from Pierce.  Pierce had taken the ball into the lane and saw the
> triple team closing in on him from the hoop side--plus a fourth defender
> coming up from behind.  Welsch was all alone at the arc, so Pierce sent
the
> ball over to keep him company.  For his part, Jiri launched the ball like
> he was Danny Ainge, and got the same result. Well, the result Ainge used
to
> get in later years, not in his rookie season.  :>)
>
> Then, James had one of those good plays/bad plays that have plagued
> him.  He dribbled the ball hard and fast upcourt--well, if he's not going
> with the long pass, at least he runs quickly.  That was good.  The bad
part
> was, he dribbled right into a double team and got stripped.  Battie was
> open at the free throw line.  a crisp bounce pass would have turned to an
> easy two from Battie, who had room.  James was obviously trying to draw a
> foul, but with 15 seconds left on the shot clock, that's not the time to
> try a suicide offense.
>
> Belatedly, he tried to pass the ball out from under the hoop back to Tony,
> who was still at the free throw line.  The problem was, now Ben Wallace
was
> in front of Battie instead of several steps behind and James did not make
a
> bounce pass.  Wallace barely had to leave his feet to take the
> pass.  Battie ended up having to commit a deliberate foul to prevent the
> easy hoop at the other end.
>
> For the second time tonight that I noticed, Vin called for the ball when
he
> was pretty far away from the hoop.  And, for the second time, from that
> range, he missed.  Vin has a great shot inside of about 12 feet.  Further
> out, it's more iffy.  I'd prefer him down low and let someone else launch
> deeper shots.
>
> Speaking of deep shots, James launched ANOTHER three with 15 seconds left,
> and both Raef and Jiri open at the other side of the arc.  Pierce was four
> feet in front of him and in position to take the ball on a give and
> go.  But no, he saw fit to rise and shoot the three, which clanged up off
> the front of the rim, rebounded off the backboard, and ended up in the
> hands of the Pistons.
>
> Next time up, James was much smarter.  He drove in, then kecked out the
> ball to Welsch--who SHOULD have shot the three, and didn't.  Waah.  James
> snagged the rebound, and this time, the three was the right shot to take,
> as the Detroit defense was now set.  It didn't fall, but it was a better
> decision.
>
> Pierce would then split the defense beautifully, and made a goaltended
> basket.  Larry Brown wasn't happy with it, but I went frame by frame from
> two angles.  It was goaltending.  The ball was on the downward arc,
barely,
> but it was.  At the other end, Pierce drew a charge.  then back to
offense,
> and Pierce kicked the ball to Welsch, who was backing up so far, I thought
> his heels were on the sideline when he caught it.  It was a good attempt,
> but missed.
>
> The C's defense kept Detroit from getting their running game going with
any
> continuity, and despite the ill-considered shot selection in some places,
> the C's were holding the lead.  Banks got stripped as he tried bringing
the
> ball up.  I saw an indication of how ineffective Banks was when on the
next
> offensive set he did not touch the ball.  In fact, the ball clearly stayed
> on the opposite side of wherever he was.  Raef sent the ball inbounds,
with
> Banks and Welsch equally available on opposite sides.  Jiri Welsch was
> chosen to bring the ball up.  Battie and Welsch passed the pumpkin back
and
> forth at the top of he key.  Raef ended up taking a shot that was
partially
> deflected and Jiri took the rebound.  Detroit committed the foul, and
> Waltah! sent the ball back into play.  Only then did Banks get the ball at
> the top of the key.  He made an outside-to outside pass to Jumaine Jones,
> who got it into Battie for two.
>
> Yes, I said "Jumaine Jones".
>
> He had just come into the game whilst Waltah! was preparing to put the
ball
> into play.  As recently as this afternoon, I figured he wasn't even going
> to be available until next week.  But there he was, in the game.  Banks
> redeemed himself on the next trip up when he zoomed to the hoop, blowing
> past the defense who fouled the rush of green wind that passed by them,
and
> made the shot though he missed the subsequent free throw.
>
> The C's defense was caught napping on the way back as Williamson made the
> kind of basket that Baker's been making hay with.  Banks replied as the
> defense fell totally away from him and dared him to take the open three.
>
> Oops.  Banks can hit that shot, when he has time to set himself.
>
> Billups followed a great shot with a dumb foul that sent Banks to the
> line.  Marcus' free throw form looked good as he made both.  The first
> quarter ended with the Good Guys leading it, 30-23.
>
> For all of what might be perceived as nitpicking on my part, The C's had a
> positive first quarter.  It was a gigantic improvement over the last
couple
> of meetings with the Pistons.  The C's did a much better job of getting
the
> ball up against the press, and the passing overall was much better.
>
>
> Second Quarter:
>
> The C's opened up with strong defense and the Pistons still hit their
first
> shot of the quarter.  Banks still has more trouble than James getting the
> ball up against the press, but at least he didn't look like he's wandered
> into the building by accident tonight.  Jumaine Jones got his first points
> as a Celtic player on a cleanup rebound.  Boston wasn't playing Jones at
> Point Guard, they were just working him into the lineup.
>
> Then Jones showed how healthy he was as he went up high for the defensive
> rebound, executed a 180-degree turn in midair and came down running on the
> break.
>
> Yeah, I'd say his legs are felling better now.
>
> The left Jones open at the other end as they tripled Pierce, so Paul
tossed
> him the ball.  James' three was short off the front rim, but his
> follow-through looked good.  I'm cutting him slack because he missed ALL
of
> the preseason, and the first three games of the regular season.  He will
> need some time to get it together physically.
>
> The C's ran fast, but not well, as Pierce got the ball poked away from
> him.  It seems that the Good Guys ARE running, but just not quite fast
> enough to really beat the defense on a consistent basis.  They have a ways
> to go, yet.
>
> Jones was sent flying as he tried to block the path top the hoop, and
> nothing was called.  This was going to be a problem for Boston, as a
number
> of Detroit transgressions would go unremarked throughout the game.  The
> saving grace was that the Pistons were really pitiful at the free throw
line.
>
> Raef wasn't ready for Ben Wallace to run the baseline, and ended up
fouling
> from behind.  Ok, no one else was ready for that one, either.
>
> The Pistons then began heating up from the three point line as Williamson
> put one down.  Detroit's defense also tightened up considerably, as the
C's
> were not able to make the fast moves to the basket that had been a
hallmark
> of the opening quarter.
>
> Boston did their work on defense, but when Okur starts hitting deep
> jumpers, you know things are not going as well as they might.  The Pistons
> did occasionally leave Pierce open, a two point mistake in this case.
With
> 6:52 left in the half, the Celtics led 38-33 as timeout was called.
>
>  From the start of the quarter, the Pistons had outscored the C's
> 10-8.  That was NOT what I wanted to see.  But the C's offense slowly got
> back on track, though Pierce missed a play--he was doubled near the elbow
> of the arc, a teammate was open at the top who had an easy pass straight
> down the lane to Vin, if they moved fast enough.  Instead he opted for a
> pass back to Battie near the corner.  Tony missed, and Vin just couldn't
> get the rebound as he was obviously pushed out of bounds from behind.  No
> call, of course.  But Williamson got brushed slightly a few moments later,
> and went to the line--again.
>
> This bit of officiating idiocy gave the Pistons the lead at 37-36, and
> brought the crown back into it.
>
> James apparently thought he was the second coming of Cousy as he tried to
> dribble through more traffic than the Big Dig, ending up without the
> ball.  Detroit made two off that.  Then Blount got the ball to Baker under
> the hoop at the other end, and Vin somehow twisted so he faced the hoop
and
> put it in.
>
> Shortly afterward, Vin grabbed a rebound despite being elbowed by a
> defender, and either a) spun beautifully away from a second defender, who
> flopped to no avail, or b) made a GREAT hip check before sinking the
> basket.  Either way, nice move.  That put Vin in double figures for the
night.
>
> I might add that Jumaine Jones spent an extended amount of time on the
> floor in the second quarter, pretty cool for a guy not expected to play
> until next week.  But I think overall, the C's were realizing this game
was
> going to be harder than the first quarter made it look.
>
> But Mike James was the recipient of a pass off a turnover that landed an
> easy to as he zoomed upcourt.  I was hoping we'd see a lot more of
> that.  On the bad side, James does not handle a pressured double well at
> all.  He tends to lose the ball.  Worse, that generally happens far enough
> out that a fast break is inevitable.  But he made a dumb play when he
could
> only be loosely described as having control of the ball on one quick trip
> upcourt.  As he allegedly kept up with the ball, he then tried to pass it
> in to Jones, but Billups was right THERE, and easily picked off the
> pass.  The Detroit announcers were eager to point out the C's turnovers,
> only to see the Pistons throw it out of bounds before the echo died.
>
> On the last play of the half, with time running out, Vin got a rebounded
> miss that he had to flip up behind his back in the general direction of
the
> hoop.  Considering the circumstances, it was a pretty darned good
> try.  Even so, as halftime came, Vin had 12 points on 5-7 shooting and 2-2
> free throws.  The C's lead in general was now 54-45.
>
>
> HALFTIME:
>
> So far, so good was the sum of it.  The C's had started to stomp the
> Pistons, but Detroit came back to make a game of it.  Now the C's were
> poised once more to begin stomping.  What had threatened to be a
> low-scoring second quarter became quite respectable by the time the teams
> took their halftime break.
>
> All the C's had to do was come out roaring in the third, and somehow
defend
> the three a little better without sacrificing their interior
> defense.  Also, the had to be careful that the Pistons didn't gain
> confidence in the pressure defense against the C's.  Basically, the
Celtics
> had to run like there was no tomorrow.
>
>
> Third Quarter:
>
> Kedrick Brown came back in to start the quarter and committed an offensive
> foul.  This is going to sound mean, but Kedrick is starting to remind me
of
> Vin last year.  No lift in his legs, silly fouls, and quick to get down on
> himself.  Though I'm still of the opinion there's an injury we aren't
being
> told about.  Kedrick isn't a GREAT player, but he's a good player, and
> certainly better then the last couple of games have been showing.
>
> Trouble was quickly brewing as Detroit's defense tightened and their
> offense spread out more.  The Pistons were doing exactly what I was afraid
> of, while the C's not getting good shots when they moved the ball around.
>
> Boston was obviously starting to look frustrated.  They are an emotional
> team this year, with players more ready to show what they're feeling on a
> play.  But Pierce was working hard, making two more free throws to bring
> the C's lead back up to nine points.
>
> But that's when the universe went "Squeak", and the Pistons began hitting
> outside jumpers and threes.  It was exactly what happened in New
> Orleans.  The other team hits threes at a nearly unprecedented rate, and
> the C's offense, now moving away from the three, cannot keep up.
>
> Baker did his best, making a nice low post move for two, but even though
> the C's defense was holding up well, the Pistons made some great offensive
> plays.
>
> One thing I noticed had changed for Boston--different people were taking
it
> out of bounds, instead of always waiting for he Point Guard to do it.
That
> helped a bit, but not enough as the C's offense was growing cold, and the
> Piston's defense was smothering at times.
>
> Someday, they're going to put a stop to that ridiculous gong sound that
> happens whenever Ben Wallace makes a basket, a rebound, or a funny face at
> the crowd.
>
> With 4:37 left in the third, the score was now tied at 62 as time was
called.
>
> Battie then made a GREAT block, but the Pistons got the rebound and ended
> up with--yep, another three.
>
> Last year, everyone in the NBA blasted Obie and the C's for relying on the
> three.  Now, everyone else is shooting without a care.
>
> Jiri Welsch went to the floor to go after a loose ball, but he had no
help,
> and wasn't able to do it alone.  Pierce then went to the hoop to make two
> back--his first two points of the third quarter!  I know he's working on
> his passing game, but I wouldn't be all that upset if he fine tuned his
> scoring game too.
>
> Banks went end to end at top speed and drew a foul.  He made both.  He
went
> back again to close the quarter, making both then, too.  The third quarter
> ended with Detroit leading it, 73-70.
>
>
> Fourth Quarter:
>
> There was a short scare as the final quarter opened, Atkins of Detroit
> turned his ankle a bit.  It was painful, but apparently ok, as he stayed
on
> the floor.  Vinnie took it to Ben Wallace and silenced the gong with two
> points in Ben's face.
>
> It was obvious that Obie knows about the clock-challenged nature of some
of
> his guys as he was hollering out the count as Welsch tried to make
> something happen.  Well, an offensive foul IS "something", but probably
not
> what his coach had in mind.  Danny Ainge was watching the play, looking
> pensive, possibly wondering,  "If I get a shaggy wig, and grab Jiri's
> uniform, maybe no one will notice."  :>)
>
> Raef put the C's back in front with a good three.  Vin was starting to
look
> tired, hunched over, and picking his spots a little bit.  God knows he'd
> been giving it his all tonight.  He ended up with the ball and an outlet
> pass that resulted in a fast break basket for the C's.  There are
> moments--brief ones--when I think Baker makes a better point guard than
> Banks or James.  But now the Good Guys were back in front, 76-73, with
9:37
> left in the game as time was called.
>
> Frustratingly, the Pistons came out of the timeout with an old-fashioned
> three point play opportunity, but missed the free throw once more.  Pierce
> nearly had a good pass to Baker in the corner, but Baker was unable to
drag
> 230 pounds of defender that had grabbed him as he moved toward the
> ball.  Alas, no call.
>
> Then Billups really started cooking, launching another three that went
> in.  There was a weird play by Baker that I don't get.  He was down low
> against Okur and waved his hand in a quick circular motion in front of
> Okur's face, but his fingers were cupped and he swiped Okur's face
> twice--while standing directly in front of the ref, who could have
> literally reached out and touched both men without extending his
> arm.  Nothing was called--amazingly--and Okur seemed to be ok.  A makeup
> call was made on the next play against Vin.
>
> The C's now had to play catch up, and with Billups hitting threes the way
I
> eat chocolate chip cookies, that was going to be a problem.  Between that,
> the fact that the Pistons seemed to come up with every loose ball despite
> strong effort by Boston--and some questionable officiating at times--the
> Pistons were managing to stay ahead throughout.  Boston never was able to
> make it happen, and the game ended with a Detroit victory, 96-88.
>
> Tough to lose, because overall, the C's played well enough that they could
> have won this game.  Once more, they got burned by a ridiculous percentage
> of made threes, abetted by a ludicrous disparity in free throws.
Detroit's
> defense was very good at times, but the C's did a comparatively better job
> of breaking it.  And, those threes--Detroit as a team shot 44%.  Prince
> alone was 4-4, outside, and Billups was 4-8.  Crazy stuff.
>
> Cookies and Crumbs:
>
> Cookies go to:
>
> Vin Baker: 20 points on 9-14 shooting, 6 rebounds, 3 assists, 2 steals and
> 2-2 at the free throw line, while playing 35 minutes.  Heck, TWO cookies.
>
> Paul Pierce: 20 points on 8-19 shooting, 7 rebounds, 10 assists,  a steal
> and a block and he was also 4-4 at the line.  He just missed two cookies
on
> his shooting percentage.
>
> Jumaine Jones:  Came back early, played well with 4 points, 5 rebounds, 2
> assists,  2 steals and a block.
>
>
> Crumbs left for:
>
> Marcus Banks: ZERO assists from a Point Guard???  Bleah.
>
> Waltah! McCarty: Not very lovable.  Didn't hurt the team, but didn't do
> anything to help and they NEED help.
>
> The officials:  Bleah, bleah, bleah.
>
> Stale crumb:
>
> Rick Pitino: You booted out Chauncey Billups, AAUGH!!!
>
> Well, the C's get to go home and face the New Jersey Nets on Friday at
> 7:30pm.  No rest for the weary.
>
> And that's the view from the doghouse.
>
>
> Snoopy the Celtics Beagle
> Please visit the <http://www.celticsbeagle.net/>Celtics Beagle Website