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three-way deal with nugs
I'm not sold on Tariq Abdul-Wahad. Am I alone on this? The guy has the size
we need at 2-guard, but he is a career 42-percent shooter, and that's
without a hint of three-point range (never as high as 30 percent). He has
been a part-time player, averaging around 20-25 minutes per game, and
scoring around 9 ppg. He also is a below-average passer and ball-handler. He
reportedly is a good defender.
He sounds to me like a poor man's Ron Mercer who, thankfully, doesn't shoot
as much and defends a little better. Now I was all for signing Abdul-Wahad
or Mercer to the exception, or even working a sign-and-trade for
Fortson/Battie/Barros or any other stiff, but it's the draft pick that
concerns me. Normally, I'd hesitate to attach too much value to a draft
pick, but if next year's draft is as strong as everyone says, then two picks
in the lottery would seem to have more value, either to us or someone else,
than Abdul-Wahad.
As for Chris Herren-yes, he's a point guard with a little size and seems to
be a relatively natural playmaker. He's also a half-step slow and only
played 13 minutes per game for a lousy Denver team last year.
Don't get me wrong-adding Abdul-Wahad and Herren while only subtracting
Barros would make the Celtics better for the upcoming season. And you could
argue it's worth it to include a draft pick. That was my first
reaction-until I looked a little more closely at Abdul-Wahad and Herren. I'm
just a little gun-shy about trading away lottery picks after the Vitaly deal
(in what was supposed to be a terrible draft class).
Of course it's all just speculation at this point, and it hinges on Anderson
going to Denver (all reports say he is leaning toward San Antonio, even if
he has to settle for the exception) and Abdul-Wahad agreeing to Boston.
We'll see.
Mark
-----Original Message-----
From: Celtics-Digest-Owner@igtc.com
[SMTP:Celtics-Digest-Owner@igtc.com]
Sent: Monday, July 24, 2000 2:53 PM
To: Celtics-Digest@igtc.com
Subject: The Boston Celtics Mailing List Digest V7 #289
The Boston Celtics Mailing List Digest
Monday, July 24 2000 Volume 07 : Number 289
In this issue:
Peter May does it again
Sign/trade Fortson to Magic/Mercer
Replying To John Lyell About Fortson and Mercer
Celtics stats for Boston - San Antonio game on 7/21
Re: Keep Kenny Anderson!
KA
Re: more summer ramblings
Re: Keep Kenny Anderson!
Less Than Good News
I missed out.
Re: Less Than Good News
Non Celts:Summer League Top Rookie
chris herren
V for G
Re: more summer ramblings
denver threeway
BSG Says 3 Way Deal Won't Happen
RE: Keep Kenny Anderson!
Re: BSG Says 3 Way Deal Won't Happen
Re: The Duck and Westphal
Re: The Duck and Westphal
Re: BSG Says 3 Way Deal Won't Happen
Rocky Mountain News Trade Article
fatal leak
D'Alessandro: Anderson to San Antonio
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 14:28:20 EDT
From: "Alexander Wang" <alexander_c_wang@hotmail.com>
Subject: Peter May does it again
Just read Peter May's column in the Globe today. It amazes me how
much he can write about a topic with no real supporting evidence.
If the Celtics were really interested in trading Walker for
Croshere,
wouldn't they have contacted Indiana about it? How come Indiana's GM
says that no one has contacted him about a sign and trade then?
May's whole column is based on the faulty logic that "Croshere would
be nutty to take $2M, therefore the Celtics must be offering
Walker."
Doesn't quite make sense, does it?
The truth is that Croshere is probably being pursued with the $2M
exception by many teams, because they can possibly offer a better
playing role than Indiana to compensate him for lost salary. As to
those, like May, who think it can't happen - what about Shandon
Anderson? Also, Indiana is probably not willing to offer him a huge
contract because he's probably going to be playing behind Dale Davis
and Jalen Rose at the forward spots for the majority of his
contract.
Croshere probably wants a situation where he can start and play 30
minutes. And Pitino has stated that he is not looking to sign and
trade for Croshere but rather get him on the open market.
Alex
________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at
http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 12:59:37 -0700 (PDT)
From: Amy Beauregard <amyeb88@yahoo.com>
Subject: Sign/trade Fortson to Magic/Mercer
"Also expected to visit will be Danny Fortson of
Boston. The Magic are talking to the Celtics about a
possible sign-and-trade deal involving guard Ron
Mercer, who they won`t be bringing back." -- Why do
that when we could sign him for the exception? Let
Fortson go if you don't want him. Better than giving
him a huge contract and taking an equal number back.
unless, of course, Mercer does not want to play here
for the exception. In that case, let him go. Do a
trade only if we are going to get some of Orlando's
other goodies (Outlaw, etc) in addition. Forget
Croshere for Twoine. Doubt even Pitino/Wallace would
do that (gulp!)
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from anywhere!
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------------------------------
Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 16:18:00 -0400
From: Way Of The Ray <wayray@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Replying To John Lyell About Fortson and Mercer
> Wallace has a verbal agreement with the Pistons and
> may go along with Chucky Atkins in a sign and trade to
> Detroit for Hill. Be happy if you can get Mercer for Fortson
> and another Celtics player. And remember with the acquisitions
> of Hill and McGrady, Orlando is almost capped out. The only way
> they can make a trade with the Celtics in the first place is
because
> they have trade exceptions. So, don't expect any mega player
> deals between the two teams. Just a simple two for one.
>
I would say the same thing to Amy too. Be happy if you can get
Mercer
for Fortson and be realistic in what it will take in terms of
contract
to acquire him. Mercer at $4 - $6 million a year, aint so bad,
not when you're paying stiffs like Pot, Williams, and Battie in the
same range.
> Ray
>
> John Lyell wrote:
>
> > With Wallace, Amaechi, & Outlaw why would they want Fortson
unless they do
> > not plan to resign Wallace or Outlaw. They also have great depth
at the 3
> > Hill, Mcgrady , Monty Williams, Harpring, Garrity & Mike Miller.
> >
> > Maybe we can package Fortson, Battie and Barros and get Mercer,
Ben Wallace
> > or even Bo Outlaw, and Harpring , Garrity or Miller ? One or
more of these
> > guys will be moved
> >
> > http://www.sportstalk.com/nba/rant/magic/index.shtml
> >
> > Has a lot of discussion about Fortson and a Doleac for Brad
Miller trade.
> > Miller would have been a nice backup 5 , he always seems to play
well
> > against us.
> >
> > .
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Way Of The Ray" <wayray@ix.netcom.com>
> > Newsgroups: alt.sports.basketball.nba.boston-celtics
> > To: "Celtics" <Celtics@igtc.com>; <sptguy33@aol.com>
> > Sent: Sunday, July 23, 2000 2:51 AM
> > Subject: Magic Talking Sign & Trade With C's
> >
> > > From Tim Povtak in today's Orlando Sentinel:
> > >
> > > Also expected to visit will be Danny Fortson of Boston. The
Magic are
> > > talking to the Celtics about a possible sign-and-trade deal
involving
> > > guard Ron Mercer, who they won`t be bringing back. The Celtics
traded
> > > Mercer to Denver a year ago, but Coach Rick Pitino wants him
back now.
> > > Mercer also could be signed by the New Jersey Nets, who need a
shooting
> > > guard with the knee problems of Kerry Kittles hanging over
them.
> > >
> > > And Povtak questions Boston's interest in Croshere:
> > >
> > > How desperate are the Celtics now to create interest in a
struggling
> > > franchise? They have been talking about Indiana Pacers free
agent Austin
> > > Croshere as if he is the next Larry Bird. Croshere has had one
decent
> > > season, and suddenly, his value is being over-inflated.
> > >
> > > Posted Jul 22 2000 10:20PM
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 18:23:56 -0400
From: Francis Hsu <francis@ai.mit.edu>
Subject: Celtics stats for Boston - San Antonio game on 7/21
Found the box score for the Boston - San Antoino game and other
Shaw's Pro
Summer League games:
http://www.nba.com/celtics/shaws_index_2000.html
Because the box score at that site is a scanned image, I'm only
putting forth
the effort to include the Celtics player's stats in this message.
(It also
means that I could very well have made typos.)
HOME: BOSTON CELTICS (1-4)
PLAYER POS MIN FG FGA 3P 3PA FT FTA OR DR TOT A PF ST TO
BS PTS
S. Mills F 23 3 6 0 0 10 11 2 0 2 0 6 0 1
0 16
R. Elliott F 29 5 12 2 5 0 0 1 5 6 2 5 1 4
0 12
M. Blount C 21 2 4 0 0 3 4 2 5 7 1 5 0 3
0 7
K. Clack G 24 3 10 0 0 2 3 1 0 1 2 6 3 2
0 8
J. Allen G 31 5 7 0 1 4 5 0 1 1 1 1 2 2
0 14
K. Salvadori 13 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 1 0 4 0 2
0 0
D. Owens 12 0 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 4 2 1
0 0
D. Vanterpool 9 1 4 0 0 2 2 1 1 2 1 2 0 0
0 4
R. Jackson 11 2 4 0 0 0 0 0 1 1 0 3 0 2
0 4
B. Martin 6 1 1 0 0 2 4 1 0 1 0 1 0 0
0 4
J. Rush 12 0 1 0 1 3 6 0 1 1 0 0 1 1
0 3
R. Bergersen 9 1 5 0 2 2 2 0 1 1 0 0 0 0
0 4
T. Battie DNP - Coach's Decision
J. Moiso NWT
H. Workman DNP - Coach's Decision
-
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
TOTALS: 200 23 56 2 9 28 37 9 15 24 8 37 9 18
0 76
PERCENTAGES: 41.1% 22.2% 75.7% TM REB: 14 TOT TO: 19
(20 PTS)
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 19:30:30 -0700
From: "Cecil Wright" <cecil@hfx.eastlink.ca>
Subject: Re: Keep Kenny Anderson!
My problem with Kenny is that I just don't feel he has shown a
willingness
to alter his game from the scorer he has thought he was in the past
to a
point guard who's primary responsibility is to get the ball to his
teammates
in a position where they are most effective.
He is strong dribbler and CAN be a good passer when he chooses to
be, but he
has that New Yawk mentality about scoring. I'm not sure he will be
able to
temper his individual game, like Tiny did, for the sake of the team.
I recall several times last year, in the few games which I was able
to see,
when Kenny would have the ball on a 3on 2 or 2 on 1 break and try to
take it
himself rather than set up someone for an easy layup. He seemed to
be
content with missing the shot or drawing a foul when a simple pass
may have
led to a 3 point play. Now he is not the only guy on the team who
is guilty
of the above transgression, but as the point guard, he should be
setting the
example.
Cecil
- ----- Original Message -----
From: Gregory Hurst <gh18@juno.com>
To: <celtics@igtc.com>
Sent: Sunday, July 23, 2000 10:08 AM
Subject: Keep Kenny Anderson!
> I really like Kenny Anderson and I probably am the only one on
the list
> that does not want to see him traded. A healthy Kenny Anderson
causes
> problems for defenses. He can pass, drive, shoot the short
jumper, and
> the three.
>
> I know at times he is a liability on defense. However, with a
shot
> blocker in the lineup, he can be decent. You can always hide him
on half
> court defense with a shot blocker. The key if Kenny is beaten off
the
> dribble, is the defensive rotation to the open man. I say keep
Kenny and
> get him a good back up to force him to play defense.
>
> How much pressure does he face in practice? He needs someone to
come in
> and put defensive pressure on him everyday. Maybe a Jerome Allen
at
> $250,000.00 who can push the ball from end to end.
>
>
>
>
> Greg
> gh18@juno.com
>
> ________________________________________________________________
> YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
> Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
> Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit:
> http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
>
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 19:24:30 -0400
From: Dan Forant <dforant1@nycap.rr.com>
Subject: KA
Hey Cecil, nice hearing from you, for once I totally agree with you,
this
could be the start of a nice friendship ;-)
At 07:30 PM 7/23/00 -0700, you wrote:
>My problem with Kenny is that I just don't feel he has shown a
willingness
>to alter his game from the scorer he has thought he was in the past
to a
>point guard who's primary responsibility is to get the ball to his
teammates
>in a position where they are most effective.
>
>He is strong dribbler and CAN be a good passer when he chooses to
be, but he
>has that New Yawk mentality about scoring. I'm not sure he will be
able to
>temper his individual game, like Tiny did, for the sake of the
team.
>
>I recall several times last year, in the few games which I was able
to see,
>when Kenny would have the ball on a 3on 2 or 2 on 1 break and try
to take it
>himself rather than set up someone for an easy layup. He seemed to
be
>content with missing the shot or drawing a foul when a simple pass
may have
>led to a 3 point play. Now he is not the only guy on the team who
is guilty
>of the above transgression, but as the point guard, he should be
setting the
>example.
>
>Cecil
>
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 13:22:48 -1000
From: bird <bird@pixi.com>
Subject: Re: more summer ramblings
>From: Gregory Hurst <gh18@juno.com>
>
>I do not see Blount making a major contribution during the season
as a
>starter. I would love to see him and mioso brought along slowly
without
>the consideration of the pressure of starting. They both can block
shots
>and probably will be the in the five spot during the press to
alter
shots.
I don't see Blount as a starter, either -- or, I should say, I
wouldn't expect him, too. since I haven't since him play, and won't
until the preseason. It's just that, if he can contribute at all,
instead of languishing on the bench, it'll be welcome. Some of the
last few big men that came through town have been disappointing (the
Eric Rileys of the world, John Thomas, et al.). I wonder if Moiso
and Blount will be in the game together? If Pitino mass substitutes
again, will we see a "second unit" that has both in the post? I
guess Battie fits in there somewhere, but doesn't the 11th man on
the
roster get minutes? Maybe Blount is that 11th man.
Regards,
Bill
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 13:50:03 -1000
From: bird <bird@pixi.com>
Subject: Re: Keep Kenny Anderson!
>From: Gregory Hurst <gh18@juno.com>
>
>I really like Kenny Anderson and I probably am the only one on the
list
>that does not want to see him traded. A healthy Kenny Anderson
causes
>problems for defenses.
It's true that Kenny Anderson has a lot of talent and skills, but
for
whatever reason, he's not the best fit for the Celtics. No matter,
though: with his salary, he ain't going anywhere.
I've lived in Oregon and saw a lot of Anderson while I was there.
He's a complicated player -- like I said, he'll show you a lot of
talent, but he's not the player he was early in his career with New
Jersey. The first ten games he with Boston are probably the best
games he'll play for the C's. Maybe he felt more free because he
didn't know the system? Anyway, a lot of criticisms I see on the
List (not pushing the ball, dribbling too much, not making the
somewhat dangerous pass, not a good defender) are classic Kenny
Anderson. On the other hand, last season, I saw Kenny Anderson play
more defense than he did the last 4-5 years combined. I didn't
always play it well, but he gave it some effort, and he _did_ make
some good defensive plays.
Kenny Anderson isn't the worst point guard for the Celtics, but he
isn't the best, either. I think he _would_ benefit from having a
big, tough, defensive-minded backup to go up against in practice.
Who guards him in practice now? Dana? Whether it be a a rookie or
veteran, we need a capable backup point, now. Please, Red, let it
be
someone better than the Alvin Williams and Haywoode Workmans of the
world.
Regards,
Bill
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 02:15:41 -0400
From: Way Of The Ray <wayray@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Less Than Good News
Steve Bulpett in today's Herald has some negatively-tinged items:
Austin Powers may be heading to Toronto, as they have $5 million
worth
of cap space available, and the Pacers aren't promising an increase
in Croshere's role.
Danny Fortson is leaning towards Golden State and a starting role.
Tariq Abdul Wahad wants more than the $2.25 million exception, and
Bulpett wonders what Denver and Boston could do for a sign and
trade.
Tony Battie's aunt was involved in a car accident, so Battie
bypassed
the summer leagues to be with her.
Desmond Mason of Seattle was named MVP of the Shaw's Summer
League. No C's made the All League team.
Marc Blount continues to show an inability to rebound with only two
yesterday, but his shotblocking is pretty good.
Ray
PS: On a positive note, Kris Clack had 20 points, 6 rebounds,
3 steals, and 3 blocks against New Jersey.
Ray
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 03:52:18 -0400 (EDT)
From: john polyak <celticpride@iwon.com>
Subject: I missed out.
I was happy to hear Paul Pierce was playing in the summer league of
Long Beach. I was not happy to hear that he's leaving. I totally missed
out. All well. Maybe next summer. It's cool to know that he performed so
well. He is such a good baller.
.............................................................
voted #1 search engine! http://www.iwon.com why wouldn't you?
.............................................................
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 06:57:21 -0400
From: Francis Hsu <francis@ai.mit.edu>
Subject: Re: Less Than Good News
On Mon, Jul 24, 2000 at 02:15:41AM -0400, Way Of The Ray wrote:
[...]
> Marc Blount continues to show an inability to rebound with only
two
> yesterday, but his shotblocking is pretty good.
He didn't do too bad in the previous two games: 5 rebounds in 16
minutes,
7 rebounds in 21 minutes
Francis
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 06:31:22 -0700
From: "Michael J.King Sr." <kingpin@primenet.com>
Subject: Non Celts:Summer League Top Rookie
- --=====================_60644409==_.ALT
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
Seattle rookie wins top honor in Boston summer league
BOSTON (AP) - Seattle SuperSonics rookie Desmond Mason was
selected as the top player in the Shaw's Pro Summer League on
Sunday. Mason, a 6-foot-5, 215-pound guard-forward selected 17th
in last month's NBA draft, averaged 18.2 points in the weeklong
tournament at UMass-Boston to lead the SuperSonics to a 4-1
record. "After watching Desmond Mason in the Shaw's Pro Summer
League, it's obvious that he has a bright future," Boston Celtics
general manager Chris Wallace said. "Desmond is a tremendous
athlete who comes to play every day. That's an explosive
combination." Mason was a first-team Big 12 selection and an
honorable mention All-American at Oklahoma State last season.
Joining him on the all-tournament team were his Seattle teammate
Shammond Williams; Milwaukee's Michael Redd; Indiana's Jeff
Foster; and Philadelphia's Jumaine Jones.
*** For the full story, see
http://www.infobeat.com/stories/cgi/story.cgi?id=2568365696-7f8
- --=====================_60644409==_.ALT
Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"
<html>
<b>Seattle rookie wins top honor in Boston summer league<br>
<br>
</b>BOSTON (AP) - Seattle SuperSonics rookie Desmond Mason was<br>
selected as the top player in the Shaw's Pro Summer League on<br>
Sunday. Mason, a 6-foot-5, 215-pound guard-forward selected 17th<br>
in last month's NBA draft, averaged 18.2 points in the weeklong<br>
tournament at UMass-Boston to lead the SuperSonics to a 4-1<br>
record. "After watching Desmond Mason in the Shaw's Pro
Summer<br>
League, it's obvious that he has a bright future," Boston
Celtics<br>
general manager Chris Wallace said. "Desmond is a
tremendous<br>
athlete who comes to play every day. That's an explosive<br>
combination." Mason was a first-team Big 12 selection and
an<br>
honorable mention All-American at Oklahoma State last season.<br>
Joining him on the all-tournament team were his Seattle teammate<br>
Shammond Williams; Milwaukee's Michael Redd; Indiana's Jeff<br>
Foster; and Philadelphia's Jumaine Jones.<br>
<br>
*** For the full story, see<br>
<font color="#0000FF"><u><a
href="http://www.infobeat.com/stories/cgi/story.cgi?id=2568365696-7f8"
eudora="autourl">http://www.infobeat.com/stories/cgi/story.cgi?id=2568365696
-7f8<br>
</a></font></u></html>
- --=====================_60644409==_.ALT--
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 11:20:29 -0400
From: OzerskyJA <OzerskyJA@cmog.org>
Subject: chris herren
what's this guy's game like?
Josh Ozersky
Marketing Communications Specialist
Corning Museum of Glass
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 11:20:46 -0400
From: Mark Estepp <EsteppJM@appstate.edu>
Subject: V for G
Josh wrote:
Any chance of trading Vitaly to Philly for Geiger? I'm not saying
I'd want
that deal because I really haven't seen Geiger play much, but I know
we
wanted him before.
Josh
============================================================================
===================================
Josh, IMHO this would be a terrible trade..... Geiger has no work
ethic. I think V is a better center right now than Geiger, and will
only
continue to out-distance him.
J. Mark Estepp
Chair, Department of Technology
Appalachian State University
esteppjm@appstate.edu
http://www.acs.appstate.edu/dept/tech/
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 17:37:24 +0200
From: Joe Hironaka <j.hironaka@unesco.org>
Subject: Re: more summer ramblings
Hi Bill Bird. This was an interesting post. The analogy you make
between the first-year Pitino club and the Walker/Moiso/Pierce
lineup is
intriguing, since that 36-win team was at times very effective on
defense
(even if the overall defensive FG% allowed wasn't that great) but
our new
2-3-4 will be far better offensively in terms of scoring, passing, a
bit
of rebounding and also experience.
I can now picture Moiso in the 2001 starting lineup and putting
up
Walter-esque first-year numbers but hiopefully with a better FG% and
equally active defense. I think anything better than that right away
from
Moiso would be a bonus, since -- bottom line -- he was overshadowed
by
the Jeff Foster's, Michael Redd's and Shammond Williams' of the
world at
the Shaw league. As hopeful as I am of Moiso's play so far, I can
picture
Andrew DeClerq putting up 35 points and 17 boards a night at this
level
of competition. A couple of teams have only one guy (in our case
Haywoode
Workman) with an NBA resume.
JaRon Rush has been a major disappointment, obviously. Poor kid,
he
could have starred on a Final Four quality team next season and
gotten
lots of national exposure. Only fools rush in...
BTW, I noticed that CBA MVP Silas Mills moved into the Shaw
starting
lineup and is making a bit of noise. How many games are left......if
any?
That all sure went by fast!
Joe
- ------
bird wrote:
> (snipped)
> >Moiso: I recall reading a chat where I think he projected himself
> >as a small forward at first, until he developed the strength to
play
> >PF. If he can play a Shawn Marion role, he won't need at outside
> >shot at that position.
>
> This is really intriguing. Moiso as sort of a McCarty with
skills.
> Since we aim to be playing more like the first year, why not think
> about a Pierce-Moiso-Walker 2-3-4? Looks a bit like the starting
> lineup from that first year. Only thing I worry about in this
> scenario is the effect of the system: I thought that in the Tao of
> Pitino, that the small forward is basically interchangable with
the 2
> guard -- both hang out more on the perimeter and take more outside
> shots. Isn't this one of the criticisms about trying Walker at
the
> 3? So maybe Pitino isn't lilely to use Moiso at the 3 -- I don't
> know. Unless it upsets the delicate balance, though, I'd
certainly
> like to try a player like Moiso or Walker there.
>
> Regards,
>
> Bill
> --
> wm. l. bird
> mailto:bird@pixi.com
> "I'll tune me fiddle and I rosen me bow"
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 11:37:32 -0400
From: OzerskyJA <OzerskyJA@cmog.org>
Subject: denver threeway
I tell you, I really like this trade so much. We get two very
strong
defensive players, including the tough, pass-first intangibles guy
at
backup point we have been looking for. And we still have our salary
exception, if not the roster spots to use it. I wish this trade
could
happen tomorrow -- my only reservation is the inclusion of one of
our
first rounders. Any thoughts on which of the picks you would trade?
Denver's will likely be lower, but it's lottery protected, while
ours will
be higher but represents a chance at Curry.
Josh Ozersky
Marketing Communications Specialist
Corning Museum of Glass
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 11:43:58 -0400
From: Way Of The Ray <wayray@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: BSG Says 3 Way Deal Won't Happen
http://home.digitalcity.com/boston/sportsguy/main.dci?page=links
Rocky Mountain News (7/24) -- Here's the actual Celts trade story
that
the Globe lifted for today's edition; the rumor has Abdul-Wahad and
Herren coming to the Celts, Dana Barros and Keon Clark going to the
Clips and Derek Anderson going to the Nuggets. What the report
doesn't
state is that the Nuggets would also be getting Denver's conditional
first-rounder that Boston currently holds (because they would be
taking
on Barros' contract). Remember, Team Pitino doesn't care about that
pick
- -- even though it's a nice one -- because it's Top Five protected
next
season and this will be Pitino's last season in Boston unless he
makes
the playoffs.
I don't see this happening because Anderson and Abdul-Wahad would
have
to be signed ahead of time, which sounds too complicated. Anderson
would
also have to agree to play in Denver, which is doubtful at best.
I still think Mercer's the guy for Boston. The only reason this
Denver
trade would appeal to them is because 1) they would dump Barros and
2)
because Pitino and Leo Papile have always liked Chris Herren, who
they
tried to get during the second round of the '99 draft (they couldn't
land a second-rounder). Anderson will end up squashing this deal
though.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 08:50:22 -0700
From: "Michael Griffin" <mgriffin@rillc.com>
Subject: RE: Keep Kenny Anderson!
I don't think you have to worry about Kenny going anywhere until
after the
2002 season (when he'll have only a year left and someone may want
him for
cap space clearance in the following year). Kenny is slightly above
average
but not worth the salary in terms of $ and years. Clearly, Pitino
traded
too much his first few years w/o considering the cap implications.
Of
course, who knows what M.L. Carr was thinking inking Barros,Minor
and
Ellison to the contracts they received. I think GMs are now in
tune. No
crazy money will be given out to fringe players. Battie may be the
best
example of giving someone too much money on "upside". Prove it to
me first
and then I'll pay you. That's my take anyway.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-celtics@igtc.com [mailto:owner-celtics@igtc.com]On
Behalf Of
> Gregory Hurst
> Sent: Sunday, July 23, 2000 10:09 AM
> To: celtics@igtc.com
> Subject: Keep Kenny Anderson!
>
>
> I really like Kenny Anderson and I probably am the only one on
the list
> that does not want to see him traded. A healthy Kenny Anderson
causes
> problems for defenses. He can pass, drive, shoot the short
jumper, and
> the three.
>
> I know at times he is a liability on defense. However, with a
shot
> blocker in the lineup, he can be decent. You can always hide him
on half
> court defense with a shot blocker. The key if Kenny is beaten off
the
> dribble, is the defensive rotation to the open man. I say keep
Kenny and
> get him a good back up to force him to play defense.
>
> How much pressure does he face in practice? He needs someone to
come in
> and put defensive pressure on him everyday. Maybe a Jerome Allen
at
> $250,000.00 who can push the ball from end to end.
>
>
>
>
> Greg
> gh18@juno.com
>
> ________________________________________________________________
> YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
> Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
> Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit:
> http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
>
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 01:52:44 +1000
From: W <titans@ihug.com.au>
Subject: Re: BSG Says 3 Way Deal Won't Happen
Derek Anderson has been quoted as saying that he likes Denver.
Probably a
marketing ploy only.
> Anderson will end up squashing this deal though.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 17:53:07 +0200
From: Joe Hironaka <j.hironaka@unesco.org>
Subject: Re: The Duck and Westphal
Bob Miller wrote:
> >>The Duck and Westphal
> >>
> >>This older guy seems to recall that the Duck went to the ABA for
money and
> >>then hurt a knee while Westphal was mysteriously traded for
Charley Scott,
> >>who was not exactly a prototype Celtic-- although he did well
for us.
> >>
> >>We assumed at the time that Westphal wanted the ball too much
and drove to
> >>the hoop so often that he did not get back on D. I don't
remember either
> >>the media or the Celtics explaining the deal properly but a
championship
> >>quickly followed and it never became a public issue.
>
> Westphal liked to take control on offense, perhaps a bit too much
for
> Coach Heinsohn. Scott, who had a reputation of a gunner, had been
a
> prolific scorer in the ABA before coming to the NBA, was taller,
more
> athletic, and a better defender. Since the C's had lost Chaney to
the
> ABA, they felt they had to have a stopper at the two-guard spot,
so
> they made the swap. Some felt the C's were taking a big chance,
but
> Red liked Scott and felt he could be taught to play the team game.
>
> In the best-of-both-worlds kind of trade, both teams made it the
> finals in 76; the Suns were a definite Cinderella team, while the
C's
> were expected to make a title run, as they had won in 74 and were
> 68-14 in 75 before Nick Weatherspoon and the Bullets upset them in
> the playoffs.
Thanks for that! I seem to recall the incredible "rainbow"
arc on Charley
Scott's jumpshot. Antoine also puts an uncommon amount of arc on his
trial
balloon 3-point set shots, even though most of them seem to clang
over the rim.
If I'm not mistaken, Scott went through a phase where he would kick
both feet
backwords on his jumper, like he was skipping rope. It seemed really
unnatural
and unbalanced, but there seemed to be a lot of effort by players
back then on
developing an individual style and razzle dazzle on the court in
those (mostly)
below-the-rim days.
Joe
p.s. Was Elvin Hayes, Bob Dandridge or Wes Unseld already part of
that Bullets
team that upset Boston? I guess the East was quite strong back then
with the
Knicks, Bullets, Celtics.
- ------
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 11:29:10 -0500
From: Bob Miller <bob@pointofchoice.com>
Subject: Re: The Duck and Westphal
>Joe
>
>p.s. Was Elvin Hayes, Bob Dandridge or Wes Unseld already part of
>that Bullets team that upset Boston? I guess the East was quite
>strong back then with the Knicks, Bullets, Celtics.
I made an error in my earlier post. Boston was 60-22 that year
(1974-75). The Bullets, with an indentical 60-22 record, won the
Central Division that year. Boston, the defending champion, was
considered the favorite in the playoffs.
The Bullets were coached by none other than K.C. Jones. They had
Unseld (league's top rebounder), The Big E, Kevin Porter (top NBA
assist man), and silky 2-guard Phil Chenier. (Dandridge came a
couple
of years later in a trade with Milwaukee in time for their '78 title
run). But it was the unheralded Nick Weatherspoon who came off the
bench and killed the C's.
But maybe they celebrated too soon as they were smoked in the finals
by Rick Barry and the Warriors.
That year only three teams in the East were over .500: the C's,
Bullets, and the Buffalo Braves (McAdoo et al).
1976: Game 6: Charlie Scott was the leading scorer for the C's with
25 points in the final game.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 13:06:09 -0400
From: Way Of The Ray <wayray@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: BSG Says 3 Way Deal Won't Happen
Well, this is better than the usual Pitino deal, though I'm hesitant
(Pitino's not) with the quality of players available to trade away
any of
next year's
picks. And I still hold out some hope they can do a Fortson to
Orlando
for Mercer deal. Maybe with Ben Wallace gone, the Magic can promise
a starting job for Danny Boy.
I will say that Wahad and Herren certainly fit into Pitino's system,
and there's hope that local product Herren could supplant Anderson
by mid-season.
Ray
W wrote:
> Derek Anderson has been quoted as saying that he likes Denver.
Probably a
> marketing ploy only.
>
> > Anderson will end up squashing this deal though.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 13:34:50 -0400
From: Way Of The Ray <wayray@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Rocky Mountain News Trade Article
Nuggets talking of trading trio
Abdul-Wahad, Herren would go to Celtics; Clark to L.A. Clippers
By Michael BeDan
Denver Rocky Mountain News Staff Writer
http://insidedenver.com/nuggets/0724nugs1.shtml
-
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------
SALT LAKE CITY - The Denver Nuggets are discussing a three-way trade
with Boston and the Los Angeles Clippers that would send Nuggets
guards
Tariq Abdul-Wahad and Chris Herren to the Celtics, Nuggets forward
Keon
Clark to the Clippers and Clippers guard Derek Anderson to the
Nuggets.
The Clippers would also get Celtics guard Dana Barros. There are
draft
picks involved, but it wasn't immediately clear who would get what.
The
Celtics own Denver's first-round pick next year as a result of the
trade
that brought Ron Mercer to Denver in August. Denver traded Mercer to
Orlando in February, a deal that brought Abdul-Wahad to the Nuggets.
Three NBA sources confirmed the trade talks Sunday night.
Celtics coach Rick Pitino told The Boston Globe the team is
exploring
many options, but he confirmed strong interest in Abdul-Wahad.
"I am going to meet with Abdul-Wahad (today) in San Jose, (Calif.),"
Pitino said.
Nuggets reserve point guard Herren said the team told him Sunday
afternoon a potential deal was in the works.
"I was told there was something going on," Herren said Sunday night,
hours after a Nuggets team of free agents, rookies and young
veterans
competed in a summer league game here. "I asked about it, and I was
told
the truth - that there is something going on."
Abdul-Wahad and Anderson are both free agents, and both would have
to
agree to terms before the trade could be completed. Paco Belassen,
Abdul-Wahad's agent, said Boston is interested in his client, but
had no
further comment. Anderson has not visited Denver. He has visited San
Antonio and indicated last week that he is leaning toward signing
with
the Spurs.
Belassen confirmed Sunday that Abdul-Wahad would return to the
United
States today. Abdul-Wahad has been vacationing in his native France.
Nuggets coach and president Dan Issel, reached by phone Sunday
night,
refused to comment.
If the Nuggets trade Herren, they would be left with two point
guards
under contract for next season - starter Nick Van Exel and veteran
reserve Cory Alexander.
The team has tried unsuccessfully to trade Alexander, and with new
team
owner Stan Kroenke declaring his plans to run a "fiscally
responsible"
organization, eating Alexander's large guaranteed contract seems
unlikely.
If the Nuggets move Herren and don't replace him, it would signal an
instruction to Issel that he has to use Alexander, whom Issel
refused to
use last season. Even when Herren was on the injured list, Issel
opted
to use swingman George McCloud and then-rookie forward/shooting
guard
James Posey at the point rather than Alexander.
Herren was born in Fall River, Mass., and grew up rooting for the
Celtics, but he said he has mixed feelings.
"It would be very good to go to Boston and play back home," he said.
"But I also love playing in Denver. I spent a very good year of time
there last year with my teammates and the rest of the people and
staff.
You get comfortable somewhere, and that's when you realize it
becomes a
business and you could be moved.
"It was a little surprising, obviously, but you learn more the
longer
you're around."
Free agents cannot sign contracts until Aug. 1.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 14:18:26 -0400
From: OzerskyJA <OzerskyJA@cmog.org>
Subject: fatal leak
This trade w/denver sounds great, but it's very unlikely to happen
--
and I suspect a big part of it is the Denver post story. If they
could
have kept a lid on it for a week, it might have went down, assuming
TAW and DA signed on the line that is dotted. But with a week for
the Denver fans to bitch, for Issel to complain, for the pundits to
weigh
in with how LA and Denver are getting robbed, I just can't see it
happening.
Let's hope there's another deal this good out there; Mercer for
Fortson
would be pretty great, especially as we would keep both our picks.
I
do hope we can get Chris Herren though. I really like what I'm
reading
about this guy.
Josh Ozersky
Marketing Communications Specialist
Corning Museum of Glass
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 14:43:16 -0400
From: Way Of The Ray <wayray@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: D'Alessandro: Anderson to San Antonio
BSG may be right....
Anderson might bypass Denver; slide to San Antonio
JULY 23, 2000
Dave D'Alessandro
The Sporting News
Derek Anderson, eager to jump the Clippers' ship, is telling friends
that he'll probably pass on a sign-and-trade offer from Denver and
accept San Antonio's middle class exception. . . .
------------------------------
End of The Boston Celtics Mailing List Digest V7 #289
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